Emad Dlala out

[dbsb3233]

Maybe because I paid for transportation and I'm not getting it due to poor manufacturing.

We paid for cars, not a transportation service though.

I get the "luxury" aspect some are talking about. Premium. And if were limited to just premium brands (that we're paying so much extra for), OK, I get it. But it seems to be becoming more the norm for non-premium brands too. Adding costs.

 

[new owner]

My 2022 Air GT has been a great ride and I have few complaints but clearly there are a lot of issues that were not on a good path for success. It seems based only on second hand info that the old team was dedicated and designed some cars with amazing features tho not without flaw( ie software etc.)
There is no doubt a big change is needed starting at the top and then downward to the factory floor. Hopefully they will get some new blood in to turn it all around quickly. Time will tell

 

[mister_caroline]

I am an enthusiastic owner reflecting positively on my ownership so far, and while brain drain feels uncertain and bad in the moment, it can make room for growth.

There is a lot of doom and gloom in this thread, but I see the glass as half full - 3.6.0 as Emad Dlala's swan song (the Gravity being Peter Rawlinson's) - enabling a lot of roadmap features and delivering meaningful quality of life improvements on his way out the door. Hands-free driving, matrix headlights, climate scheduling, driving styles, continuing to iterate on lock/unlock, trip sharing from mobile... My already enjoyable car has become even more enjoyable and modern after a 2 hour update. Apologies to the vocal few/several that have had recurring issues, but I have been enjoying my vehicle in relative silence (doing my best to speak up). Let's remember that a man is not a team, and the team should be applauded.

The temperature in this room of armchair managers is that a lot of people feel like they are owed something - returns on investments, better quality products and services, etc. Let's take a moment to remember that this is a nascent company making a brand new, highly complex and regulated product in an unprecedented time of global and economic uncertainty and turmoil. We early adopters have always carried risk chasing 1st gen products and sorry not sorry if you didn't know that going in. Despite all of this, and however messy and winding the road they took, Lucid actually shipped.

Think about all the EVs from legacy manufacturers that fell short of expectations or were recently canceled:

• Volvo EX30 (canceled after 2 years)
• Volvo EX90 (shipped with a to-do list on day 1, Luminar partnership axed, numerous bugs, and 2025s don't get latest infotainment hardware)
• Mercedes EQB (battery fire risk if charged >80%)
• VW ID Buzz ("canceled", terrible range, most cars shipped in single color and dealers offered credit to wrap into two tone)
• VW ID.7 (canceled)
• Tesla S/X (canceled)
• Hyundai Ioniq 5/6, Kia EV6/EV9, Genesis GV60/GV70/GV80 ICCU issues
• Honda Prologue/Acura ZDX/Acura RSX (canceled)... etc.

Think about the misses and missteps from stalwarts like Mercedes, VW group (Audi, Porsche) and Honda that will impact their portfolios for years to come.

Think about other family-oriented "safe" cars that have had recalls or incidents with seats - Highlander, Sienna, Palisade.

Think about the degradations in service departments across the board (personal anecdotes, maybe you have your own)

• fewer dealers offering loaner cars in my area, and when they do, they are scheduling those appointments months out, and they are typically base models
• Audi promising infotainment updates to address bugs by adding me to a PSS (pending service solution) list that never bore fruit during the 4 years I owned the $100k car

If you want and are used to a brand having a dealer network, then by all means use your dollars to support NADA and their values.

I bought into the vision of "Compromise Nothing" knowing full well that marketing departments across any vertical play fast and loose with our emotions and pocketbooks.

Technologists celebrate the iPhone 4S/5 (posthumous) as Steve Jobs' last visionary products but shareholders seem to appreciate the 10x appreciation in the stock price more under Tim Cook's operational excellence.

 

[electric]

I'm talking about the Gravity and its plethora of issues from 3rd row seats bouncing, re welding thousands of seats, light bars falling apart, trim falling off, door handle and window issues that have taken over a year to fix.

key fobs.

The word "hardware" is often confusing in EV world depending on one's perspective. To some EV nuts like myself hardware refers to the rolling sled consisting of 3 components - motor, inverter, battery. Lucid excels here and pretty much the only reason I bought my Gravity. If they sold a rolling sled with a wooden stool bolted down, I'd buy it.
To others "hardware" could mean keyfob, seats, doors, windows, trim, lights, HVAC etc. I think Lucid is terrible at making those things with reliable quality and usability, especially considering it supposed to be a luxury vehicle.
For this reason I think Lucid's future is to be a supplier of motors, inverters and batteries to those OEMs who know how to make everything else in a car.

 

[Pragmatic]

I'm paying for a reliable vehicle ro transport me and my family. If the vehicle can't do this during the warranty period I think the least the OEM can do is provide a loaner. It costs the OEM very little, assuming they make reliable cars that when they fail can be quickly repaired.

 

[socktucker]

Please don’t describe experiences you haven’t had. We have absolutely no idea how widespread any issues are, but many people haven’t had any with Gravity.

Also, this is off topic. Please stay on topic.

Had most of them in my loaner Gravity.

Anways what I'm saying is Emad quiting or getting quitted isn't going to fix anything, but the projected usefullness of his expertise might have changed. I hope that makes sense. No man is an island.

 

[socktucker]

The word "hardware" is often confusing in EV world depending on one's perspective. To some EV nuts like myself hardware refers to the rolling sled consisting of 3 components - motor, inverter, battery. Lucid excels here and pretty much the only reason I bought my Gravity. If they sold a rolling sled with a wooden stool bolted down, I'd buy it.
To others "hardware" could mean keyfob, seats, doors, windows, trim, lights, HVAC etc. I think Lucid is terrible at making those things with reliable quality and usability, especially considering it supposed to be a luxury vehicle.
For this reason I think Lucid's future is to be a supplier of motors, inverters and batteries to those OEMs who know how to make everything else in a car.

I see what you're saying. Lucid actually doesn't make a single item that I named except the software that controls them, and Emad wasn't a software guy I don't think? Lucid made some mistakes sure but their suppliers did them dirty.

 

[borski]

Had most of them in my loaner Gravity.

Anways what I'm saying is Emad quiting or getting quitted isn't going to fix anything, but the projected usefullness of his expertise might have changed. I hope that makes sense. No man is an island.

Sure, fair enough. Wasn’t trying to jump on you - just trying to keep this thread from derailing.

 

[DreamTour]

I am an enthusiastic owner reflecting positively on my ownership so far, and while brain drain feels uncertain and bad in the moment, it can make room for growth.

There is a lot of doom and gloom in this thread, but I see the glass as half full - 3.6.0 as Emad Dlala's swan song (the Gravity being Peter Rawlinson's) - enabling a lot of roadmap features and delivering meaningful quality of life improvements on his way out the door. Hands-free driving, matrix headlights, climate scheduling, driving styles, continuing to iterate on lock/unlock, trip sharing from mobile... My already enjoyable car has become even more enjoyable and modern after a 2 hour update. Apologies to the vocal few/several that have had recurring issues, but I have been enjoying my vehicle in relative silence (doing my best to speak up). Let's remember that a man is not a team, and the team should be applauded.

The temperature in this room of armchair managers is that a lot of people feel like they are owed something - returns on investments, better quality products and services, etc. Let's take a moment to remember that this is a nascent company making a brand new, highly complex and regulated product in an unprecedented time of global and economic uncertainty and turmoil. We early adopters have always carried risk chasing 1st gen products and sorry not sorry if you didn't know that going in. Despite all of this, and however messy and winding the road they took, Lucid actually shipped.

Think about all the EVs from legacy manufacturers that fell short of expectations or were recently canceled:

• Volvo EX30 (canceled after 2 years)
• Volvo EX90 (shipped with a to-do list on day 1, Luminar partnership axed, numerous bugs, and 2025s don't get latest infotainment hardware)
• Mercedes EQB (battery fire risk if charged >80%)
• VW ID Buzz ("canceled", terrible range, most cars shipped in single color and dealers offered credit to wrap into two tone)
• VW ID.7 (canceled)
• Tesla S/X (canceled)
• Hyundai Ioniq 5/6, Kia EV6/EV9, Genesis GV60/GV70/GV80 ICCU issues
• Honda Prologue/Acura ZDX/Acura RSX (canceled)... etc.

Think about the misses and missteps from stalwarts like Mercedes, VW group (Audi, Porsche) and Honda that will impact their portfolios for years to come.

Think about other family-oriented "safe" cars that have had recalls or incidents with seats - Highlander, Sienna, Palisade.

Think about the degradations in service departments across the board (personal anecdotes, maybe you have your own)

• fewer dealers offering loaner cars in my area, and when they do, they are scheduling those appointments months out, and they are typically base models
• Audi promising infotainment updates to address bugs by adding me to a PSS (pending service solution) list that never bore fruit during the 4 years I owned the $100k car

If you want and are used to a brand having a dealer network, then by all means use your dollars to support NADA and their values.

I bought into the vision of "Compromise Nothing" knowing full well that marketing departments across any vertical play fast and loose with our emotions and pocketbooks.

Technologists celebrate the iPhone 4S/5 (posthumous) as Steve Jobs' last visionary products but shareholders seem to appreciate the 10x appreciation in the stock price more under Tim Cook's operational excellence.

I don't think any of us think we are owed anything or there is entitlement. We all want Lucid to be successful and I think we are discussing the prognosis of tearing out a franchise player - perhaps looking for an explanation that reconciles our positive experiences with Emad and how this could be interpreted as helping Lucid move forward successfully. We're all hoping it will.

10 years is a long time - and as you mentioned Lucid did ship, whereas others never made it to the finish line or abandoned. It could be as simple as "after 10 years and the journey to take it from nothing to where it is now" it was just time. Maybe Emad needed to move on and wasn't going to stick around for the next epic. I've certainly been there after seeing the groundhog's day plot at my last company too many times.

 

[L-Dude]

...Technologists celebrate the iPhone 4S/5 (posthumous) as Steve Jobs' last visionary products but shareholders seem to appreciate the 10x appreciation in the stock price more under Tim Cook's operational excellence.

Yeah, except the quality of Apple's software has slowly deteriorated over the past decade. It used to be rock solid. Now it is buggy as hell (based on my 40+ years of experience with the company).

 

[martinjlm]

Well, the stock price seems to reflect most of our disappointment: $5.75 -> $4.85 in just a few hours

The whole market tanked today. TSLA dropped 3.8%. NVDA dropped 3.73%. I still track those, even though I sold my holdings in both a couple weeks ago.

 

[erigion]

We paid for cars, not a transportation service though.

I get the "luxury" aspect some are talking about. Premium. And if were limited to just premium brands (that we're paying so much extra for), OK, I get it. But it seems to be becoming more the norm for non-premium brands too. Adding costs.

The dealerships for non-luxury brands are offering this because they make a boatload of money from their service department and want a way to differentiate themselves from independent mechanics, who are often cheaper.

 

[TahoeMichael]

In all fairness that is not their marketing, it's the result of their market analysis. After all, this was for an investor presentation, not for customers.

I've spent way too much time talking to product manager types. The language they used is classic product management jargon. As an engineer, I've never loved that way of looking at the world. But good product management pays off, and I'm hesitant to just assume it's all stupid and useless. One thing it definitely isn't is a marketing strategy, as others have already noted.

 

[gaskiller]

It is not an overreaction to be concerned about the sudden loss/departure of the essential asset that was Emad Dlala. I spent the last few months considering a senior role in software at Lucid. Emad was the pull for that; that is, he was the reason I considered taking the job, when otherwise it would be a difficult sell (for me, since I was “funemployed” by choice). He is an incredible leader, and though he pushed his people extremely hard (working weekends until software is up to par, for example), he also worked them himself. This garnered the respect of his teams because crunch time meant everyone was all-in, not an imposition from above. He expected as much from himself as he did from his teams. He knew how important the combination of speed and face time was, and he was making good changes. I think this is well-evidenced by the results.

He did drive his people hard. But he did it while managing to make it feel like everyone was on the same team. And he really cared; that much was very clear.

Emad made people want to work for and with him.

I’ve also met Marc, the new VP of Software. I like him. He’s very smart, and we had a great conversation. I’m not taking anything away from him at all. He’s great, and I’m really looking forward to seeing how he changes things and moves things forward.

But losing Emad is harmful; there’s just no two ways about it.

(I ended up taking a role running the Agentic Red Team @ DeepMind, in case anyone’s curious, a role I couldn’t say no to)

Isn’t Emad an expert in powertrain, not software?

The next 5 years, Lucid needs software. All the other ICE manufacturers are cutting down on EV investments. Creating the best powertrain never worked without good software. But good software works with a mediocre powertrain when selling cars.

Lucid needed to distance itself from the old way, cut costs, so they can survive. No point going down the sane Air/Gravity route.

And Lucid owns all the patents. Unfortunately Rawlinson Dream team were good at engineering but bad at everything else. I don’t see him leaving a positive or negative. Shoulder shrug, move on!

 

[gaskiller]

I am not saying that engineers should necessarily run a car company. But losing them to the organization or subordinating their role too severely is fraught with risk.

There was wide consensus among observers of the Big Three in the latter half of the last century that the primary reason they descended into the product mediocrity -- and financial crises -- of the 70's and 80's was the general clearing out of engineers from the C Suites and replacing them with bean counters. With that came Cadillac's loss of the arguably legitimate claim to be the "standard of the world" in automotive engineering to slapping chromed plastic and a vinyl roof on a Chevy Cavalier to become the standing joke of the industry.

Yeah, but Lucid has never become successful

 

[TahoeMichael]

I'm someone who has been put off by Lucid's missteps enough that I lost a $1K deposit and backed out of my Gravity order. So I appreciate the need for house cleaning and an attempt to right the proverbial ship. But I placed that order because of the absolutely world class engineering that Lucid has been doing. So to hear Dlala is out, my mind immediately goes to wondering whether Lucid is losing the key traits that led me to them in the first place. For my mood to change, the new leadership needs to start articulating some future for the company that is appealing. Buying (or even leasing) a $100K+ vehicle from a startup is a gamble (just ask an Ocean owner), and I don't want to take that bet without having more reason to believe in their future than I've got right now. They need to move past the steady drum beat of bad news.

I had been thinking that I would reengage with my SA after the new Gravity OTA, and see what lease terms are on offer in June for a 2027 Gravity. But now I'm back in a wait-and-see mode, and will probably not be talking to an SA until September (if things are looking up at that time). Or I may just decide that there's other things I can spend that money on, and plan to buy a less exciting but cheaper EV instead.

 

[gaskiller]

Yep - Tesla was creating everything out of whole cloth - they were literally inventing the ecosystem entirely with no precursors. The companies that have followed have it easier and harder at the same time - they can learn from Tesla’s experience, leverage those suppliers, use tested processes and tech, and hopefully shorten the ramp, but they also now have to compete against an entire army of other brands and much higher (and more demanding) customer expectations. Some brands decided to “bespoke” everything and are paying a terrible price for that decision.

I didn’t go to CEO school, but if fixing the service morass and getting out from under the comically bad spending on rental cars for weeks on end even for basic service items is not priority number one right now, all the rest won’t matter. Lucid has to expand the service footprint, keep customers happy, and stop the absolute hemorrhaging of money to Enterprise. Yes, having the cars operate correctly in the first place would clearly help, but that ship has sailed. The warranty costs are astronomical and aren’t sustainable.

The last thing Lucid needs is to try to push the envelope with a bunch of cool tech that is so different from everyone else, yet misses on the basics and leads to the massive backlog for service.

My prediction is that Lucid ends up being acquired by a legacy OEM to provide the engineering hardware for their own EV ambitions - like an Aston Martin or Lamborghini or even VW. The hardware is so good that there is real value there but the actual business is just a sinkhole swallowing cash.

Saudi won’t sell, that’s pretty clear

 

[gaskiller]

I’m a construction executive with 30 years experience and have built many high-rises across the US and beyond including Saudi Arabia. Schindler was on many projects... Compared to other disciplines like HVAC / security/ BMS systems (Johnson controls, Siemens etc) the elevator business sticks out as a non competitive business where the three or four companies have each 4 products and know everything about each others products. The product is a box that gets pulled up and down on rails by a rope. The interiors often done by others. The management of install and service is mostly ridiculous compared to other trades. The innovation in this business is non existence in 30 years I have seen two major improvements that's it. I wish Lucid good luck transitioning to the new CEO and I'm looking forward to seeing what experience of the elevator business will help with making the most innovative car company work better…

Napoli is known for being cost conscious, the spending is what is doing Lucid in.

 

[TahoeMichael]

Napoli is known for being cost conscious, the spending is what is doing Lucid in.

I disagree. They're investing appropriately for building vehicles. The problem is that they've had too many quality and production challenges. The spending would be entirely reasonable if their quality and production problems weren't biting them, and reducing spending will do them little good if they can't address the two fundamental problems.

 

[gaskiller]

Emad was the middleman, reporting to the CEO on powertrain and software. He is not a software expert. Maybe it was time to get rid of that role and cut costs. Maybe Emad didn’t like what was offered.