EA is Improving

[Daniel2022AT]

Yeah it really is a bit circular. EA wants to place charging stations in areas that already have a good volume of EVs - and WV isn't one of them. But without the availability of stations, it discourages the purchase of EVs. However, charging stations are not exactly analogous to gas stations so we will never have the same density of EV chargers. Most people charge at home at a considerably lower electrical cost so charging stations are mostly for longer trips. However even at $0.48 per kWh, the cost to "fill" even for 10 to 100% capacity is around $45. A Mercedes S Class has a 22 gallon tank. How low does premium gas have to go down to make it comparable?

Most EV’s have a battery around 70-80 KWH. Charging from 20% to 80% is about 40-50kWH for a charging session. That is about $20-25 for about 175-200 miles of range. That is about equivalent to gasoline at $3/gal. Fortunately, most EV owners charge at home for a small fraction of that cost.

 

[Adidas]

Yeah it really is a bit circular. EA wants to place charging stations in areas that already have a good volume of EVs - and WV isn't one of them. But without the availability of stations, it discourages the purchase of EVs. However, charging stations are not exactly analogous to gas stations so we will never have the same density of EV chargers. Most people charge at home at a considerably lower electrical cost so charging stations are mostly for longer trips. However even at $0.48 per kWh, the cost to "fill" even for 10 to 100% capacity is around $45. A Mercedes S Class has a 22 gallon tank. How low does premium gas have to go down to make it comparable?

The high charging costs relative to Tesla help with availability. Soon most of the Ford and Rivian drivers will be using Superchargers preferentially. $0.56 vs $0.34 for Magic Dock in my area.

 

[HariK]

The high charging costs relative to Tesla help with availability. Soon most of the Ford and Rivian drivers will be using Superchargers preferentially. $0.56 vs $0.34 for Magic Dock in my area.

And charging at home in PGE Northern CA can cost a minimum of 42 cents per kWh and going up a lot more than inflation.

 

[Lucken]

Dang 45 minutes of preconditioning?? I get that it was very cold outside, but any idea how much time these cars take the precondition in more normal conditions? Usually I have about 10 minutes to precondition on my way to my nearest EA station but I get pretty low speeds from the start. Like maybe in the ~120kw range at 40%

I’m also curious how much energy is consumed in 45 minutes of preconditioning @15F. I‘m sure it’s significant.

 

[DeaneG]

And charging at home in PGE Northern CA can cost a minimum of 42 cents per kWh and going up a lot more than inflation.

Time of use rates help with that- unless you need to run the air conditioner a lot in the afternoon.

 

[HariK]

Time of use rates help with that- unless you need to run the air conditioner a lot in the afternoon.

See the new you rates.

 

[Daniel2022AT]

I’m also curious how much energy is consumed in 45 minutes of preconditioning @15F. I‘m sure it’s significant.

Very small. Maybe it consumed 1-2 kWh.

 

[Daniel2022AT]

And charging at home in PGE Northern CA can cost a minimum of 42 cents per kWh and going up a lot more than inflation.

Wow. I’m speechless. My condolences. I charge on a TOU rate of $.073/kWh. Regular rate is $.173/kWh.

 

[DeaneG]

See the new you rates.

Ah, They have gone up a lot. I'm on EV2A, $0.34/kWh off-peak now. But it used to be something like $0.15!
Maybe it is time for some more solar panels.

 

[Daniel2022AT]

Without a doubt. I want to do solar panels but I can’t get the economics to work.

 

[Lucken]

Very small. Maybe it consumed 1-2 kWh.

Not bad, but one must still take that into consideration if you're really running very low on charge. Tesla drivers in Chicago found that out the hard way. Obviously there were other factors in that disaster, but it's still worth noting if you're really running low on your SOC.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

For anyone complaining about cold temp charging speeds, here’s the Merrimack outlets EA in New Hampshire on preconditioned battery at 34F.

 

[hmp10]

Wow. I’m speechless. My condolences. I charge on a TOU rate of $.073/kWh. Regular rate is $.173/kWh.

We don't have off-peak rates from our provider (an electric cooperative that buys its power from Florida Power & Light). But here's our rate schedule for residential users:

1st 500 kWh - $0.1129
Next 500 kWh - $0.1206
Over 1000 kWh - $0.1282
Plus flat $20.00 fee per household

76% is generated by natural gas
11% is generated by solar
11% is generated by nuclear
2% is generated by "other" (maybe oil, as the last coal-fired plant was shut down several years ago)

Florida Power & Light currently has the most aggressive solar expansion plan in the nation, supported by a regulatory structure that favors solar installations by utilities over solar installations by individuals.

 

[DeaneG]

...Florida Power & Light currently has the most aggressive solar expansion plan in the nation, supported by a regulatory structure that favors solar installations by utilities over solar installations by individuals.

IMO that's the way to do it. Utility-scale solar and corresponding online storage (pumped hydro, flow batteries, etc) can be done for a fraction of the cost of a million homeowners trying to do the same thing on their roof and in their garage.

 

[hmp10]

IMO that's the way to do it.

Agree. No issue for the homeowner with roof leaks, keeping panels clean, having to deal with Florida hurricane and storm damage, watching output decline over time, etc.

 

[TFCooper]

IMO that's the way to do it. Utility-scale solar and corresponding online storage (pumped hydro, flow batteries, etc) can be done for a fraction of the cost of a million homeowners trying to do the same thing on their roof and in their garage.

Here in Massachusetts, I installed a rooftop 18kw array about 4 years ago, along with three Powerwalls. There's no way it would have made economic sense without the massive 30% tax credit from the Feds and the state, and the ongoing subsidy from the utility. Not even close.

The utility (Eversource) pays me the retail rate of about 28¢ to connect to their grid, along with an incentive payment of 18¢ per kwh (under the SMART program). Meanwhile, Eversource can buy power for 5¢-15¢ per kwh from wholesale vendors, which include HydroQuebec. ISO New England has a cool real-time website on prices.

ISO New England

www.iso-ne.com

The upshot is that guys like me who can afford expensive electric cars and solar arrays on big houses get subsidized by those who can't. And the subsidy is massive: my friend in the town of North Reading only pays 16¢/kwh for electricity, since the small municipal utility doesn't have to comply with all these crazy subsidies and regulations.

 

[Lucken]

The upshot is that guys like me who can afford expensive electric cars and solar arrays on big houses get subsidized by those who can't. And the subsidy is massive: my friend in the town of North Reading only pays 16¢/kwh for electricity, since the small municipal utility doesn't have to comply with all these crazy subsidies and regulations.

And if we’re objective about it, it borders on the unethical.

 

[GM!]

for those who travel to/from/through San Francisco…

Electrify America set to open its first indoor EV charging station to the public this week

EV charging network Electrify America will soon offer the public an EV charging experience safe from the elements, where drivers...

electrek.co

 

[BACamster]

Thoughts?

‘First-of-its-kind’ EV charging station in San Francisco offers indoor lounge for customers

(AP/KRON) — A couple of blocks from the Bay Bridge, Electrify America is about to open an indoor charging station in San Francisco that lets drivers relax in a lounge while their electric vehicle b…

www.kron4.com

 

[scal_air]

Thoughts?

‘First-of-its-kind’ EV charging station in San Francisco offers indoor lounge for customers

(AP/KRON) — A couple of blocks from the Bay Bridge, Electrify America is about to open an indoor charging station in San Francisco that lets drivers relax in a lounge while their electric vehicle b…

www.kron4.com

I'd rather they spend the money on more charging stations...I sit in my enclosed climate controlled car while charging. Or just put the chargers in shopping centers with Starbucks or restaraunts. My 2 cents