Charging road trip perspective
- Thread starter Fischman
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Very classy of them to box out the one remaining charger with an ICE vehicle so that she'd have a free charger when she showed up. Utterly clueless.
This whole article reads like an ad for Tesla Superchargers. And it makes the White House look clueless and (as mentioned above) out of touch with ordinary Americans.
Elon couldn’t have written this better himself.
WTF happened to NPR?
The worst part is that it advances the idiotic myth that public charging is the main problem with EV adoption. Sure, we need stronger charging networks. But access to home charging and making sure all this charging is happening on the backbone of clean energy infrastructure is the main issue.
I really wish the media in this country would get a freaking clue.
Elon couldn’t have written this better himself.
WTF happened to NPR?
The worst part is that it advances the idiotic myth that public charging is the main problem with EV adoption. Sure, we need stronger charging networks. But access to home charging and making sure all this charging is happening on the backbone of clean energy infrastructure is the main issue.
I really wish the media in this country would get a freaking clue.
The article reads like a Tesla ad for a reason. Generally speaking, their network appears to be more complete and reliable with respect to fast charging. I have never owned a Tesla and it wasn't on my list to consider when I was looking to replace my BMW M5. I primarily charge my Lucid at home or at my lake house. I choose not to take it on any long road trips due to the charging worries. The southeastern US in not ready for mass EV adoption. The few times I have taken my car from Charlotte to Atlanta or to Chapel Hill, I experienced the same sorts of issues that they did, chargers not working, limited opportunities to charge, etc. I was usually able to charge, but that probably would not be the case if EV adoption was much greater.
Public charging is a huge problem with respect to EV adoption in certain parts of the country. The vast majority of people cannot make a purchasing decision of this magnitude without considering the possibility that they might need to take their vehicle on a long journey. Sure 90%+ of the time they will be fine being able to rely on home charging. It's the other 10% that might cause them to make a different purchase decision. If my budget is tight, why would I buy a car that presents that worry. It is the primary reason that I will not purchase an EV for my wife. We need her car to be an ICE vehicle to make trips to the beach, New Orleans, Nashville, etc., longer trips where I might hesitate taking the Lucid. I can't imagine the experience of packing young kids up in the car to drive to Disney World from Charlotte and having to charge along the way, especially if the number of EV's on the road were higher.
I am not even going to get in the determination of if the energy I use to charge comes from a clean energy source because I really don't know and it might lead down a political rabbit hole.
Public charging is a huge problem with respect to EV adoption in certain parts of the country. The vast majority of people cannot make a purchasing decision of this magnitude without considering the possibility that they might need to take their vehicle on a long journey. Sure 90%+ of the time they will be fine being able to rely on home charging. It's the other 10% that might cause them to make a different purchase decision. If my budget is tight, why would I buy a car that presents that worry. It is the primary reason that I will not purchase an EV for my wife. We need her car to be an ICE vehicle to make trips to the beach, New Orleans, Nashville, etc., longer trips where I might hesitate taking the Lucid. I can't imagine the experience of packing young kids up in the car to drive to Disney World from Charlotte and having to charge along the way, especially if the number of EV's on the road were higher.
I am not even going to get in the determination of if the energy I use to charge comes from a clean energy source because I really don't know and it might lead down a political rabbit hole.
Well-written and informative. Thanks for posting link. Here's the gist:
"That required upfront work that a gas-powered road trip simply doesn't require. My car can hypothetically locate a nearby charger on the road — as with many EVs, that feature is built into an app on the car's infotainment screen — so I shouldn't have to plan ahead. But in reality, I use multiple apps to find chargers, read reviews to make sure they work and plot out convenient locations for a 30-minute pit stop (a charger by a restaurant, for instance, instead of one located at a car dealership)."
And then send the Secret Service fleet of Escalades ahead to block off the one working charger ...
"That required upfront work that a gas-powered road trip simply doesn't require. My car can hypothetically locate a nearby charger on the road — as with many EVs, that feature is built into an app on the car's infotainment screen — so I shouldn't have to plan ahead. But in reality, I use multiple apps to find chargers, read reviews to make sure they work and plot out convenient locations for a 30-minute pit stop (a charger by a restaurant, for instance, instead of one located at a car dealership)."
And then send the Secret Service fleet of Escalades ahead to block off the one working charger ...
We planned a visit to Cape May, NJ for a couple of days ( with local sight-seeing ~ 300 mile round-trip ). The wife and I spent several hours beforehand plotting a course among chargers...only to find: there aren't any fast chargers along the seashore from NYC to Miami. ??
We ended up loading a couple of aps to find chargers and use them, but none of them proved to be useful. I ended up charging to 98% before leaving home, and even though it was hitting the high 90's all three days (36 degrees) we arrived back home three days later with 26% SOC, averaging 3.8 m/kWh. We left from the 'burbs and drove through Philly and across the pine barrens and South all the way to the Lewes' ferry in the Southern most part of the State. At the ferry there are 4 chargers. None of them work, which is fine, as the cord on them is like 20 gauge... I think they are meant for those electric kiddy cars one sees all over the barrier islands...about 1 kW ? No matter, they look like they haven't been used in years. We found this to be true of all the "chargers" on the barrier islands in NJ. There are no fast chargers other than Tesla.
The wife and I got into a tiff over finding and trying to make the chargers work. It was very hot. Afterwords she (who insisted we take an ICE car on the trip) said, "I think I get it. I see a car as transportation. You see the Lucid as an adventure and a challenge."
... yes.
Last edited:
Halodde
Active Member
I don't feel like it was pro tesla any more than reality is. Tesla definitely does have the best charging network. Nobody can argue that they don't. That doesn't mean they have the best cars. But, we would all be happier and not have these discussions if EA had the same number of chargers and same reliability as the supercharger network. It will just take some time before we get there.
I could have easily just said "to avoid difficult conversations with the Wife"...
I, too, see it as a challenge I might be willing to take if travelling alone. I would rather avoid the conversations with the wife who might rather take her big, boring, yet comfortable, SUV.
So let me get this straight: 90% of the need is for home charging, but 100% of our focus should be on improving public charging for those 1-2 road trips per year? Makes perfect sense.
Let's start with the obvious: Many, many American families have more than one car. There's zero reason you can't have an EV while your wife has an ICE car. If everyone did that much, we'd be 50% of the way there. That instantly solves the "road trip" problem for the majority of people.
With the cost savings from gas, oil changes, other maintenance, you could rent a car for those 1-2 road trips and still come out ahead. So even those without 2 cars could likely break even with an EV, at least.
If we vastly improved access to home charging (by mandating it in new home building and apartment complexes, by adding strong financial incentives for legacy home owners, and by eliminating these stupid "Free public charging" incentives EV makers keep giving away) public EV charging would be limited to only those who are taking road trips. That would eliminate much of the congestion happening now with folks treating fast charging like they do local gas stations. We will never need nearly as many public chargers as we currently have gas stations. We just need them in the right places, and we need them to be reliable. Which is an issue, since that means it's likely never going to be as strong a business as gas stations are currently. Which is why I keep saying public charging is a best treated as a loss leader for existing businesses along interstates. Restaurants, convenience stores, hotels, and so on.
So I repeat: The real issue with EV adoption is home charging and access to clean energy. Yes, EVs are still too expensive, too. But I also think that issue is largely overblown. The average selling price of new cars in the US is not that far off from an entry-level Model 3, Bolt, etc. And that will solve itself as more people buy EVs and production costs decrease.
Folks are looking for excuses NOT to buy an EV. And the media keep feeding it to them, rather than educating us on basic facts. We get nothing but a daily litany about the drawbacks, while no one ever talks about the obvious benefits.
Adding to this, the free charging BS is contributing to the unavailability of chargers, once that stops the stops I expect there to ba an easing up of availability.
Well, we can agree to disagree. I never said that 100% of the focus (let alone "our" focus) should be on improving public charging. I did say that it was a major consideration for those considering an EV, let alone the cost of an EV in comparison. Are you saying to ignore that concern altogether? Based on your comments "of being 50% of the way there", I think any further discussion might lead us into a realm of political discourse as well as theoretical consideration of EV's in general, which is not where I think we should be going. I am not sold one way or the other on EV's being the solution to anything, all things considered. I am not in a position to say they are or they aren't and really do not care to go down that road.
I am not one of those who thinks EV's are the answer, to just about anything, nor am I a detractor. I got the Lucid, not because I had to have an EV, but rather because I liked the look and wanted something different. I love the car, but wish it made more sense to take on trips. If that were the case, the 90/10 might be different. There was nothing magical about those numbers. they were just random.
As for free fast charging, there is only one EA location in Charlotte and it is located in a part of town I find myself in maybe twice a year and most here would never use, so free charging is not really a factor here in Charlotte.
Honestly, with hindsight being 20/20 and reality being a little different than I originally thought with respect to charging (my fault as I made some really bad assumptions), I may not have been as quick to purchase this car. That being said, I enjoy it for what it is knowing the limitations. I enjoy having something different and answering any questions about it that people may have. Heck, I even gave a guy a test drive who contacted me on this forum and drove in from Columbia, SC to see the car. I just wish I could be more confident to take this car on longer trips.
I also do not want to go down the rabbit hole on "clean energy" or government "mandates".
I am not one of those who thinks EV's are the answer, to just about anything, nor am I a detractor. I got the Lucid, not because I had to have an EV, but rather because I liked the look and wanted something different. I love the car, but wish it made more sense to take on trips. If that were the case, the 90/10 might be different. There was nothing magical about those numbers. they were just random.
As for free fast charging, there is only one EA location in Charlotte and it is located in a part of town I find myself in maybe twice a year and most here would never use, so free charging is not really a factor here in Charlotte.
Honestly, with hindsight being 20/20 and reality being a little different than I originally thought with respect to charging (my fault as I made some really bad assumptions), I may not have been as quick to purchase this car. That being said, I enjoy it for what it is knowing the limitations. I enjoy having something different and answering any questions about it that people may have. Heck, I even gave a guy a test drive who contacted me on this forum and drove in from Columbia, SC to see the car. I just wish I could be more confident to take this car on longer trips.
I also do not want to go down the rabbit hole on "clean energy" or government "mandates".
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My recent trip from Milwaukee to Tampa with the Lucid went without any problems. Between EA and EVGo we always found easy access to chargers with actual performance of 100KW or better. I would not hesitate to do another road trip.
Home charging in a single family home situation is simple. I think the big gap is destination charging at hotels and shopping malls.
Home charging in a single family home situation is simple. I think the big gap is destination charging at hotels and shopping malls.
I am sure personal experiences color opinions. My situation is a case in point.
I decided to try living with EV by renting a tesla model 3 on a recent Florida summer trip. The airbnb didn't have a charger , but there were a couple of tesla superchargers ~20 min away. I thought to myself "we should be covered."
One station was in a sketchy part of town with out of service bathrooms, the other was decent in a mall parking lot but no nearby conveniencestore. Over one week and about 400 miles , we needed to charge 4 times, each with terrible charge rates, requiring >35 minutes each. Range anxiety is real once you figure out usable battery is 20-80% soc realistically.
Tesla may have better infrastructure, and it may be reliable, in that it works. But not sure that it is all what it is hyped up to be. We are keeping an ICE car in the household for family trips.
I decided to try living with EV by renting a tesla model 3 on a recent Florida summer trip. The airbnb didn't have a charger , but there were a couple of tesla superchargers ~20 min away. I thought to myself "we should be covered."
One station was in a sketchy part of town with out of service bathrooms, the other was decent in a mall parking lot but no nearby conveniencestore. Over one week and about 400 miles , we needed to charge 4 times, each with terrible charge rates, requiring >35 minutes each. Range anxiety is real once you figure out usable battery is 20-80% soc realistically.
Tesla may have better infrastructure, and it may be reliable, in that it works. But not sure that it is all what it is hyped up to be. We are keeping an ICE car in the household for family trips.
