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Car and Driver prototype drive of Porsche Cayenne EV

I should have added, Porsche is one of the brands where I believe many buyers do not comparison shop. They love Porsches, decide they want an EV, and they get a Porsche EV. I put Mercedes, BMW and Cadillac in that category, too - not that they are similar to Porsches, but more a brand loyalty or “stickiness” or social bling factor…

I realize someone will reply and say they did comparison shop or they have a Mercedes EV, etc - the group of folks here is not indicative of “Joe/Jane EV buyer”. If we were, we wouldn’t own a Lucid or really consider one.
 
Ron_Burgundy said:
I realize someone will reply and say they did comparison shop or they have a Mercedes EV, etc - the group of folks here is not indicative of “Joe/Jane EV buyer”. If we were, we wouldn’t own a Lucid or really consider one.
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Obligatory, i did comparison shop :), i want to make sure you feel validated in your conclusion lol
. ... but yea, i did compare the Escalade. but only a non-newbie is going to look at the long charge times and realize thats a deal breaker. Or that its not a concern because of not using it for road trips. To get all the comparable features is 130-150K which isnt far off, and at this price point, not the deal breaker... or atleast that was my view. But for the price i didnt like the FAKE crystal (other than safety, wouldnt glass or a harder poly felt better and not cheap?) and other plastic parts. The smallish windshield felt to closed in as well. Like painting your room in black, if your goal is to shrink the perceptible space, then sure go ahead.
 
JoeSchmo said:
Obligatory, i did comparison shop :), i want to make sure you feel validated in your conclusion lol
. ... but yea, i did compare the Escalade. but only a non-newbie is going to look at the long charge times and realize thats a deal breaker. Or that its not a concern because of not using it for road trips. To get all the comparable features is 130-150K which isnt far off, and at this price point, not the deal breaker... or atleast that was my view. But for the price i didnt like the FAKE crystal (other than safety, wouldnt glass or a harder poly felt better and not cheap?) and other plastic parts. The smallish windshield felt to closed in as well. Like painting your room in black, if your goal is to shrink the perceptible space, then sure go ahead.
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Thank you for validating my post!

Generally, I find the “luxury” car makers use far too much plastic or other cheap materials wherever they can. This is especially true for US makers (looking at you Cadillac). Every time I see a sleek corvette, I think “yeah, but the inside is manly plastic…”

One thing Doug D got right in his “review” is the excellent quality materials in the Gravity cabin.
 
Ron_Burgundy said:
Thank you for validating my post!

Generally, I find the “luxury” car makers use far too much plastic or other cheap materials wherever they can. This is especially true for US makers (looking at you Cadillac). Every time I see a sleek corvette, I think “yeah, but the inside is manly plastic…”

One thing Doug D got right in his “review” is the excellent quality materials in the Gravity cabin.
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*mainly, not “manly plastic”… wow. Don’t want the mods to get upset about graphic posts…
 
I like Porsche's offerings in the EV space, but can't really wrap my head around the pricing. I think if their cars were priced similarly to Lucids, then they'd be more appealing, but right now you're looking at a $50k+ price difference for similar specs and worse tech. Their driving dynamics are good, but not too dissimilar from Lucids.
 
prgarg said:
I didn't like the absence of one pedal driving
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Tesla (and now Lucid) have confused everyone on this issue. Teslas and Lucids have traditional friction braking systems. When you step on the brake, it activates the friction brakes. Many other EVs, including Porsche and Genesis, have blended braking systems. In those systems the initial depression of the brake pedal activates regen. Only a hard press or a full press activates the friction brake.

Therefore one gets about the same regen driving like one drove an ICE vehicle. One doesn't have to have one pedal driving to activate the regen system and one can coast so one might actually get better range.

IMO, a good blended system is superior; but a poorly implemented one can be worse.
 
Steveinarizona said:
Tesla (and now Lucid) have confused everyone on this issue. Teslas and Lucids have traditional friction braking systems. When you step on the brake, it activates the friction brakes. Many other EVs, including Porsche and Genesis, have blended braking systems. In those systems the initial depression of the brake pedal activates regen. Only a hard press or a full press activates the friction brake.

Therefore one gets about the same regen driving like one drove an ICE vehicle. One doesn't have to have one pedal driving to activate the regen system and one can coast so one might actually get better range.

IMO, a good blended system is superior; but a poorly implemented one can be worse.
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Sign me up for a good blended braking system, and coasting when you take your foot off the gas pedal. I find Tesla drivers often rave about one-pedal driving, but they also seem pretty insistent that you need a high quality cruise control system as well. I personally find one-pedal to be more tiring on a long drive, thus the demand for a cruise control. To me, one-pedal driving seems like compensation for not solving the engineering challenge of a good blended brake systems, rather than being a fundamentally good design.
 
Elfin said:
It's actually only 2 inches shorter. I'm sure the Gravity has way more interior volume though.
The range will definitely be shorter but the charge speed will make it competitive (like how the Taycan is a faster road tripper than the Air.)
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I see that Car & Driver's Sept 30th article about the Cayenne EV's interior quotes the cargo space as being 56 ft^3 when the rear seats are folded. So no where close to what the Gravity has.
 
TahoeMichael said:
Sign me up for a good blended braking system, and coasting when you take your foot off the gas pedal. I find Tesla drivers often rave about one-pedal driving, but they also seem pretty insistent that you need a high quality cruise control system as well. I personally find one-pedal to be more tiring on a long drive, thus the demand for a cruise control. To me, one-pedal driving seems like compensation for not solving the engineering challenge of a good blended brake systems, rather than being a fundamentally good design.
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100% spot on. Except I'd like the option for one pedal around town.
 
The_Don said:
100% spot on. Except I'd like the option for one pedal around town.
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I am currently an ICE driver and Gravity will be first EV. Can someone tell me what is so special about one pedal driving vs a “properly” done blended brake? I get the feeling that most people who swear by one pedal are coming from Tesla which forced their drivers into this approach (since they could not master blended brake.)
 
Bdr100 said:
I am currently an ICE driver and Gravity will be first EV. Can someone tell me what is so special about one pedal driving vs a “properly” done blended brake? I get the feeling that most people who swear by one pedal are coming from Tesla which forced their drivers into this approach (since they could not master blended brake.)
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It's just much easier for in-town driving and in stop-and-go freeway traffic. You don't have to keep moving your foot back and forth, less wasted motion and less delay in making the speed adjustment you want. We use it in both our cars, and we have a choice in both.
 
Bdr100 said:
I am currently an ICE driver and Gravity will be first EV. Can someone tell me what is so special about one pedal driving vs a “properly” done blended brake? I get the feeling that most people who swear by one pedal are coming from Tesla which forced their drivers into this approach (since they could not master blended brake.)
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It is literally just easier. It is more like a go-kart, and once you get used to it, it becomes extremely natural, and the 'old blended braking' method feels absurd. It's obviously not, but that's how it feels for me.

I did not come from a Tesla.
 
I far prefer the smooth change to the transfer of energy that I get with OPD. It's more comfortable.

Is it more efficient? Probably not if you use it in a similar way to how you would drive an ICE. I use it with a strong zen filter to never accumulate speed/momentum that I'm just going to have to bleed off (note: that doesn't mean I'm a slow-poke, but I also don't zoom up to stop lights and screech to a halt right on someone's bumper - I bleed momentum gradually on the approach). I haven't done any back to back experiments to see if it is more or less efficient, but I'm not sure I care. It's efficient enough for my needs and the experience is phenomenal.

Can you be smooth with blended braking? If you have good habits then it can be pretty smooth. Limo and ambulance drivers have provided that experience for decades without regen and OPD. But, there is a discontinuity in the curve. You can treat that as an advantage by viewing coasting as a valuable tool, but in the end it's still a discontinuity and you can coast with OPD anyway.

One thing I will commend blended braking on is that it doesn't require a driver to learn new tricks if they are coming from an ICE experience. Some consumers are not going to want to be told they have to "drive different(TM)(ly)".
 
Bdr100 said:
I am currently an ICE driver and Gravity will be first EV. Can someone tell me what is so special about one pedal driving vs a “properly” done blended brake? I get the feeling that most people who swear by one pedal are coming from Tesla which forced their drivers into this approach (since they could not master blended brake.)
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If you do it properly, you never have to move your foot from the accelerator to the brake pedal. It is very nice to keep you foot over one pedal, and as regen is slowing the car you can put your foot on the floor, timing the regen stop perfectly. I love 1PD. And of course efficiency is great when driving like that.
 
I think there are many other factors differentiating the Gravity from Cayenne EV than OPD and 600 kW blended braking. Things like handling / steering feedback (Porsche), interior space (Lucid by far), reliability (so far neither), price (Lucid), place of manufacture (depends on your outlook) and more. Only one is/will have a third row so that is an easy differentiator. BTW 600 kW of blended braking is like 780 hp of acceleration so basically 60-0 in a few seconds which means the brake pads will almost never be used.
 
babylou66 said:
I think there are many other factors differentiating the Gravity from Cayenne EV than OPD and 600 kW ...
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The Cayenne EV will have native Google maps, useful for those of us that travel to out of the way places. No need for Android Auto.
 
DeaneG said:
I heard that Porsche was still working on off-road mode software. I'm presuming this could loosen up the hydraulic suspension. But Porsche isn't known for rapid software development.
The range figure estimated by the author was a little disappointing and also rather expected.
If you don't need three rows or a ton of cargo room, the Cayenne EV's shorter length is a plus over Gravity.
Cayenne EV has native Google maps, a mature entry key system, and should have excellent build quality.
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@DeaneG, I find myself agreeing with you almost all the time, but in this day and age I deeply want to support the “underdog.” I’d love a world with more choices, not less, and I just could not bring myself to go Porsche over Lucid unless the Porsche vehicle was significantly better than Lucid’s and, in this case, the Gravity is exceptional despite the few teething pains that Lucid is certain to overcome. Keep the faith!!!
 
Posted today.

 
I expect the Cayenne EV to be on-par with the Gravity on driving dynamics, range, and charging. I expect Gravity to have better cargo capacity, as the Cayenne maintains a more traditional ICE long-hood silhouette. I also expect Gravity to win on pricing, probably by a large margin. Given the technical problems Gravity has had, and Porsche's track record, it seems reasonable to expect that the Cayenne EV will be less trouble prone than the Gravity.
 
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