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AirPlay/AA / PAAK / Mic Update - next update

tmichael said:
Polestar, I just share a key from my wallet to another person’s wallet (Apple phones). Flawless. Up to 5 users. Can take it back anytime.
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Obviously so we can Turo our Gravity's 🤣
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
It's a stupid feature that they shouldn't waste bandwidth and money developing. Honestly, the key as phone thing is a dumb idea that has led to far more complaints than additional buyers.
Much better to get all the basic functionality working rather than introducing geegaws.
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Speak for yourself. I hate carrying a fob around where depending on its design, buttons can be inadvertently hit while in your pocket. The phone as a key worked quite well for me when I had the Air and have been itching for it to arrive with Gravity.
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
It's a stupid feature that they shouldn't waste bandwidth and money developing. Honestly, the key as phone thing is a dumb idea that has led to far more complaints than additional buyers.
Much better to get all the basic functionality working rather than introducing geegaws.
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PAAK is something that all EVs should have, Tesla has perfected this and it makes life so much easier. No more key fobs, you just walk up and the car unlocks, you get in and drive away. When you get out it locks automatically when you walk away. How could anyone think this is a dumb idea. I would love to know what you mean when you say it has lead to far more complaints than buyers. Since Gravity hasn’t had PAAK yet, how is anyone complaining?
It’s more secure than key fobs that are being spoofed.
 
Kairide said:
PAAK is something that all EVs should have, Tesla has perfected this and it makes life so much easier. No more key fobs, you just walk up and the car unlocks, you get in and drive away. When you get out it locks automatically when you walk away. How could anyone think this is a dumb idea. I would love to know what you mean when you say it has lead to far more complaints than buyers. Since Gravity hasn’t had PAAK yet, how is anyone complaining?
It’s more secure than key fobs that are being spoofed.
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I generally agree that if you carry a phone anyway, then it saves you from needing to also have a fob in your pocket. But is it really any more secure? I was under the impression that the radio protocol for the fob and PAAK was equivalently secure.
 
Kairide said:
PAAK is something that all EVs should have, Tesla has perfected this and it makes life so much easier. No more key fobs, you just walk up and the car unlocks, you get in and drive away. When you get out it locks automatically when you walk away. How could anyone think this is a dumb idea. I would love to know what you mean when you say it has lead to far more complaints than buyers. Since Gravity hasn’t had PAAK yet, how is anyone complaining?
It’s more secure than key fobs that are being spoofed.
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It does not make life "so much easier"- it possibly saves a few seconds every day. If it malfunctions in some fashion, the inconvenience may be serious. (My buddy's Tesla autolocked in the middle of a blizzard on a Maine back road when he stepped out to take a piss- took him a few minutes of waving his phone around before it unlocked). Depending on some third party device with ever changing software and tenuous security is certainly a choice one can make.

What I mean is, Lucid message boards and social media about Lucid Airs are absolutely rife with complaints about phone related (and other) software features that malfunction frequently. If a vehicle has an included feature then people have an expectation that it works , if it doesn't work, owners are rightfully pissed.
When you are a start-up with limited resources, putting in features that are at the very bottom of the functionality list that don't work is just very dumb. No one is buying a 100K sedan or SUV because you can use your phone as a key. A lot of people might avoid buying said vehicles because they read all the complaints about software malfunctions.
As for security- key fobs have been a solved problem for at least 30 years now.
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
It does not make life "so much easier"- it possibly saves a few seconds every day. If it malfunctions in some fashion, the inconvenience may be serious. (My buddy's Tesla autolocked in the middle of a blizzard on a Maine back road when he stepped out to take a piss- took him a few minutes of waving his phone around before it unlocked). Depending on some third party device with ever changing software and tenuous security is certainly a choice one can make.

What I mean is, Lucid message boards and social media about Lucid Airs are absolutely rife with complaints about phone related (and other) software features that malfunction frequently. If a vehicle has an included feature then people have an expectation that it works , if it doesn't work, owners are rightfully pissed.
When you are a start-up with limited resources, putting in features that are at the very bottom of the functionality list that don't work is just very dumb. No one is buying a 100K sedan or SUV because you can use your phone as a key. A lot of people might avoid buying said vehicles because they read all the complaints about software malfunctions.
As for security- key fobs have been a solved problem for at least 30 years now.
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Not having a fob in the first place does make life so much easier. One less thing to not lose or replace the batteries. Sounds like you’ve never experienced a car with PAAK. You’re basing your opinion off your “friend”, not first hand experience.
Your friend waving his phone around? He could have just hit the unlock button from his app. User error isn’t software error.
Having a reliable way to lock/unlock and drive is the foundation of a vehicle. I believe the key fiasco is one of the main reasons the software team got cut.
People are most certainly expecting PAAK as standard when buying a six figure EV, even an $50k EV. Ever since Tesla set the bar with it having a key fob is outdated.
Key fobs are not a solved problem:

Yes, criminals can make duplicates of your key fob from outside your home

Just a Pair of These $11 Radio Gadgets Can Steal a Car
 
joec said:
Maybe another scenario would be if you were on vacation, and someone needed to move your car real quick to another spot for some strange reason. Still seems like the sort of thing I'd use once a year, at best.
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This is actually a very useful feature for allowing someone to move your car. Maybe a valet when you forget to bring your key card or fob. Which for me is always.

And about 9 years ago, we had this exact need with our Model S. We mistakenly left our car on the wrong side of the street in SF when we left for Australia. We were able to use the app to have a friend access our car, we then remote started it for him, and this allowed him to re-park it for us. It was unbelievable as we did the entire thing sitting in Circular Quay at Sydney Harbor waiting for the ferry. At that time, we had never conceived of this being possible but it was super easy.

Lucid should have this feature too and looks like they will soon.
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
It does not make life "so much easier"- it possibly saves a few seconds every day. If it malfunctions in some fashion, the inconvenience may be serious. (My buddy's Tesla autolocked in the middle of a blizzard on a Maine back road when he stepped out to take a piss- took him a few minutes of waving his phone around before it unlocked). Depending on some third party device with ever changing software and tenuous security is certainly a choice one can make.

What I mean is, Lucid message boards and social media about Lucid Airs are absolutely rife with complaints about phone related (and other) software features that malfunction frequently. If a vehicle has an included feature then people have an expectation that it works , if it doesn't work, owners are rightfully pissed.
When you are a start-up with limited resources, putting in features that are at the very bottom of the functionality list that don't work is just very dumb. No one is buying a 100K sedan or SUV because you can use your phone as a key. A lot of people might avoid buying said vehicles because they read all the complaints about software malfunctions.
As for security- key fobs have been a solved problem for at least 30 years now.
Click to expand...
I totally disagree. PAAK is an expected feature of all EVs. I think Tesla nailed it and all other EV makers consider this a table stakes feature. It is a huge advantage for EVs over ICE cars. Part of the software design from the ground up. We live in a phone centered world. Everything is on our phone. Not having our car access on it is a major miss.
 
Kairide said:
Not having a fob in the first place does make life so much easier. One less thing to not lose or replace the batteries. Sounds like you’ve never experienced a car with PAAK. You’re basing your opinion off your “friend”, not first hand experience.
Your friend waving his phone around? He could have just hit the unlock button from his app. User error isn’t software error.
Having a reliable way to lock/unlock and drive is the foundation of a vehicle. I believe the key fiasco is one of the main reasons the software team got cut.
People are most certainly expecting PAAK as standard when buying a six figure EV, even an $50k EV. Ever since Tesla set the bar with it having a key fob is outdated.
Key fobs are not a solved problem:

Yes, criminals can make duplicates of your key fob from outside your home

Just a Pair of These $11 Radio Gadgets Can Steal a Car
Click to expand...
I own a 2025 Air GT. Fabulous driving experience. So far the worst thing is it not having any on/off button. Completely inexcusable. My wife has an Ioniq 6- also a fabulous car equipped with PAAK
There is 0 chance I will ever use my phone as a key to anything, nor will I ever set the car to automatically lock or unlock. I will also never connect my toaster oven to the Internet.
Oh, he did press the unlock button on his app- multiple times. Eventually it worked
As for Fob security- it's only a problem on cars that have keys that communicate with the car from multiple feet away and constantly broadcast so they do stupid things like automatically locking/unlocking.(even then only some models where manufacturers slacked- if it was easy to make these devices work, a bajillion cars would be stolen.). Why would you have a key that can be detected from 10' away? God forbid you'd have to press a button to lock and unlock the car. Also, your phone works exactly the same way.
Do you not carry keys to your house, or does your phone lock and unlock that as well?

The pioneering of PAAK by Tesla is analogous to them pioneering using a touch screen to control the wipers and the yoke steering wheel. Both gimmicks of dubious utility

You missed my point about features working- Lucid has had a long problematic history with making the phone as key thing work consistently- they would have been way better off just not having it at all. The bugs have no doubt cost them sales, whereas the lack of the feature wouldn't make a difference.
I don't own a Gravity, but it seems they didn't learn much from the Air in that they started selling it while it was still full of software bugs. Apparently, the 3.4 update has fixed quite a few of them which is good. I'm hopeful they get all the real problems addressed and thoroughly vet an implementation of PAAK before they release the next update so they don't find themselves taking flak for a malfunctioning feature that is not required to operate the car. PAAK is a geegaw which some people may enjoy, but it is by no means essential.
 
RajD said:
I totally disagree. PAAK is an expected feature of all EVs. I think Tesla nailed it and all other EV makers consider this a table stakes feature. It is a huge advantage for EVs over ICE cars. Part of the software design from the ground up. We live in a phone centered world. Everything is on our phone. Not having our car access on it is a major miss.
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Huh? No reason PAAK can't be implemented on ICE cars. Under no circumstances is PAAK ever a huge advantage in any case. It is a marginal convenience when it works
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
I own a 2025 Air GT. Fabulous driving experience. So far the worst thing is it not having any on/off button. Completely inexcusable. My wife has an Ioniq 6- also a fabulous car equipped with PAAK
There is 0 chance I will ever use my phone as a key to anything, nor will I ever set the car to automatically lock or unlock. I will also never connect my toaster oven to the Internet.

Do you not carry keys to your house, or does your phone lock and unlock that as well?
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This is so ridiculous you must be trolling at this point.
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
the key as phone thing is a dumb idea
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I have to disagree. The PAAK with the Tesla and Polestar was a HUGE positive for the ownership experience. Carrying my fob and keycard feels like the 20th century - and we're a quarter of the way through the 21st! I couldn't care less if the key fob or key card worked, if PAAK did. Then, the key card would only be used for valet. In my world, PAAK is not a feature, it's simply my car key. Or, should be...
 
FeelLicks said:
Obviously so we can Turo our Gravity's 🤣
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Hmmm... Renting a car in a strange city with a car that might not start and tells me things are wrong that aren't... nah, doesn't quite fit my idea of "vacation"... 😁
 
Mr.Quindazzi said:
There is 0 chance I will ever use my phone as a key to anything, nor will I ever set the car to automatically lock or unlock. I will also never connect my toaster oven to the Internet.
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That is much more understandable. It appears you do not want to have the advantage of PAAK and wouldn't use it if you could. That is perfectly acceptable, as it is your choice. But for those buyers who seek out items that do connect to the internet (when I arrive home and no one is home yet, my automation system disarms the alarm, turns on certain lights if dark and sets the HVAC to my preferred temperature), I look forward to it. PAAK is no longer a feature in the software defined vehicle era. It is an expected function and should be available for those who want it. For me, it is no different than over the air updates - fixes and improvements can be made without the hassle of taking a car to a dealer.

I'm reminded of my 2021 Dodge Durango Hellcat. Every 3 years, I could buy a USB drive to update the OEM navigation map. Thankfully, they had CarPlay integration - another connection to the internet I can only presume is not important to you.

America, where you are free to choose and use your checkbook to decide. It's a wonderful place to live!
 
RajD said:
This is actually a very useful feature for allowing someone to move your car. Maybe a valet when you forget to bring your key card or fob. Which for me is always.

And about 9 years ago, we had this exact need with our Model S. We mistakenly left our car on the wrong side of the street in SF when we left for Australia. We were able to use the app to have a friend access our car, we then remote started it for him, and this allowed him to re-park it for us. It was unbelievable as we did the entire thing sitting in Circular Quay at Sydney Harbor waiting for the ferry. At that time, we had never conceived of this being possible but it was super easy.

Lucid should have this feature too and looks like they will soon.
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Yes. This is the best argument I’ve heard. But I don’t see how this is better than just having Tesla’s OTHER, more powerful feature of granting anyone temporary access for whatever time period you deem.

In other words, a button I have to tap and then my friend needs to jump into the car within two minutes feels like the fast and dirty version of allowing me to share access via a Lucid account.

Or as anyone with Apple Car Key in their BMW will tell you, you can share your key electronically with a few taps. Revoke it at any time.

Perhaps once Gravity gets true Car Key support, this fast and dirty version will no longer be needed. I guess if it was easy enough to do, they figured it was a good stop gap?
 
dbsb3233 said:
Happy to see AA confirmed again. Carplay is mentioned more often but there's a lot of us Android people too.
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Totally. And the fact they are releasing both at the same time is a nice improvement compared to Air, where it was a serious gap between CarPlay and AA.

I think the plan is also the same when it comes to Apple Car Key and Google's digital key. Seems like Lucid is trying, at least, to have parity at launch for these things now, rather than prioritizing one over the other.
 
tmichael said:
I have to disagree. The PAAK with the Tesla and Polestar was a HUGE positive for the ownership experience. Carrying my fob and keycard feels like the 20th century - and we're a quarter of the way through the 21st! I couldn't care less if the key fob or key card worked, if PAAK did. Then, the key card would only be used for valet. In my world, PAAK is not a feature, it's simply my car key. Or, should be...
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Totally agreed.
 
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