Software leadership team fired

[pezpunk]

What clearly happened on Winterhoff's watch was the decision to start Gravity deliveries with the software in such a miserable state as well as either to skip factory inspection points or to ignore failures to pass inspection. (I know for a fact that this happened with our first Gravity delivered in June, as someone at Lucid admitted to me that checking that navigation systems were functioning only started after that car was shipped, and there was absolutely no way its badly distorted HUD screen was not noticed on the factory test circuit.)

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer. The message popped up the instant I put it into drive to move it out of Lucid’s garage at delivery. Lucid seems to have a cancerous problem of lying to itself about the state of things.

 

[pezpunk]

For the record, I’m happy with the car - but the whole purchase/delivery process was sketchy.

 

[Adnillien]

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer. The message popped up the instant I put it into drive to move it out of Lucid’s garage at delivery. Lucid seems to have a cancerous problem of lying to itself about the state of things.

I don't think that you can know for sure if Lucid new about the drive unit failure. There is a chance that it happened when you put it into drive and Lucid had no way of knowing that this would happen. Did Lucid tell you what caused the failure. I doubt that Lucid would intentionally deliver a car with a failed drive unit to a customer.

 

[pezpunk]

Well you’re far more naive than I am.

 

[msaunders9430]

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer. The message popped up the instant I put it into drive to move it out of Lucid’s garage at delivery. Lucid seems to have a cancerous problem of lying to itself about the state of things.

So why your car? Rhetorical question.

There are plenty of posts on this forum about owners having the delivery of their car delayed due to issues discovered during PDI, before transport from the factory, and other stages of the factory - to - customer process. There are owners who have been contacted by Lucid after delivery when issues the customers were not even aware of, were detected by Lucid followed by a request have the car brought in for repair.

I'm thinking your last sentence about Lucid lying to itself is hyperbole based on your frustration. The CEO email to customers clearly shows otherwise.

 

[johnse]

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer.

My understanding is the electronic components in the Inverter have what is referred to as a bathtub failure curve (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bathtub_curve). They do burn in tests in manufacturing to try and weed out the majority of infant mortality cases. But some small number will slip through.

It is entirely possible that your car was working fine in PDI and when they parked it for delivery.

The good news is that there is a much lower chance of failure from this point on.

 

[hwy17er]

There's this:

"Lack Of Curiosity": Here Are 19 Signs Of Someone Who Isn't That Sharp, And Now I Can't Look At People The Same Anymore

These are changing the way I view the 'smart' people around me.

www.buzzfeed.com

 

[tarator]

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer. The message popped up the instant I put it into drive to move it out of Lucid’s garage at delivery. Lucid seems to have a cancerous problem of lying to itself about the state of things.

Was it a software issue? If not, can you please not discuss it in this thread? Thanks!

 

[Miami_Lucid_Man]

I’m loving this sudden wave of transparency coming out of the company. They stayed silent for a long time but now it’s clear they’ve been working diligently behind the scenes to address these software issue both on the Air and Gravity. They’ve clearly made an internal decision to do this in a more outward facing way and I think it really works. I have no doubt they’ll get this stuff sorted out. Give them time. We’re all early adopters.

 

[jace]

I don't really understand a lot of the criticism here. Basically the entire engineering leadership team that had responsibility for software has been replaced, going right up to Rawlinson. I think it's appropriate to be upset that Lucid decided to deliver Gravities to customers when it obviously wasn't ready, but we don't really know who made that decision, or why. If we knew all the facts, it might be reasonable to call for Winterhoff's head. But as other's pointed out, it may not have been his decision. And while he hasn't been fired, he also hasn't been made permanent CEO, so perhaps the board is exacting a punishment on him. For now, I'm quite content to see how their leadership change plays out, and it seems like there's been more accountability for leadership than many companies demonstrate.

Agree, the fact that someone said "it's good enough, let's go" is mind boggling with how poor this vehicle is from an experience of living with it.
I regret every day for jumping in to the ownership / lease of this vehicle , the price I paid to be an "Alpha" software tester is not worth the frustration of daily new issues. Today it was this one:

 

[pezpunk]

So why your car? Rhetorical question.

There are plenty of posts on this forum about owners having the delivery of their car delayed due to issues discovered during PDI, before transport from the factory, and other stages of the factory - to - customer process. There are owners who have been contacted by Lucid after delivery when issues the customers were not even aware of, were detected by Lucid followed by a request have the car brought in for repair.

I'm thinking your last sentence about Lucid lying to itself is hyperbole based on your frustration. The CEO email to customers clearly shows otherwise.

Sure, they drove the car around for 37 miles without issue, but at mile 37.001, the very first inch a customer moved the vehicle, was the first instant that error appeared. You can believe that if you want. Or you can google Occam's Razor. Your choice. I've made mine.

Was it a software issue? If not, can you please not discuss it in this thread? Thanks!

My comment was absolutely on-topic of the paragraph i quoted, which was in regards to pushing forward to customer deliveries with a known-flawed product. "Thanks!"

 

[socktucker]

Mine was delivered with a defective drive unit, and there is ZERO chance — ZERO — that Lucid did not know this. The car had 37 miles on the odometer. The message popped up the instant I put it into drive to move it out of Lucid’s garage at delivery. Lucid seems to have a cancerous problem of lying to itself about the state of things.

Yup like mine was delivered with a crack in the trunk they had waxed over. There was no way they didn’t know it was there. However I don’t think the decision was up to the delivery guys, I think they were supposed to deliver whatever they had and fix it later. In sales it’s called “SWAT”. Somewhere someone made the decision to launch all the and fix it later. Did the entire software team decide that? I doubt it. I don’t like that Winterhoff was prior COO, which meant he probably made the decision to launch the way they did.

 

[borski]

Sure, they drove the car around for 37 miles without issue, but at mile 37.001, the very first inch a customer moved the vehicle, was the first instant that error appeared. You can believe that if you want. Or you can google Occam's Razor. Your choice. I've made mine.

Actually, Occam’s Razor works against you here. It is obviously not the simplest answer that Lucid conspired or didn’t care, as that leads to obvious issues.

The simplest answer, regardless of the fact that you don’t like it, is that you got unlucky.

@msaunders9430 is correct.

 

[socktucker]

Actually, Occam’s Razor works against you here. It is obviously not the simplest answer that Lucid conspired or didn’t care, as that leads to obvious issues.

The simplest answer, regardless of the fact that you don’t like it, is that you got unlucky.

@msaunders9430 is correct.

is that what you really believe

 

[msaunders9430]

is that what you really believe

This isn't a matter of belief. It's application of the principle. It's that "simple".
If the principle of Occum's Razor (quite famiilar with it) is going to be applied, as suggested, "you got unlucky" is a more simple answer than Lucid conspired or didn't care.

Continued discussion doesn't contribute to this thread; not software related.
Go with whatever you choose to believe regarding your car. It's your car.

 

[Bdr100]

This isn't a matter of belief. It's application of the principle. It's that "simple".
If the principle of Occum's Razor (quite famiilar with it) is going to be applied, as suggested, "you got unlucky" is a more simple answer than Lucid conspired or didn't care.

Continued discussion doesn't contribute to this thread; not software related.
Go with whatever you choose to believe regarding your car. It's your car.

The vast majority of conspiracy theories are absolutely counter to Occum’s Razor.

 

[dbsb3233]

I agree but it should start at the top. Where was he when it was being developed? It is not like the software for the Air was perfect so he could rightfully assume it was under control. I don't see how the CEO can let the Gravity go without knowing how good or bad the software was. If heads have to roll, it should start with his.

It already did. The CEO (Rawlinson) left at the end of February (back when the Gravity was supposed to be rolling out). That's why they only have an interim CEO now (Winterhoff) trying to sort out the mess.

 

[dbsb3233]

What clearly happened on Winterhoff's watch was the decision to start Gravity deliveries with the software in such a miserable state as well as either to skip factory inspection points or to ignore failures to pass inspection. (I know for a fact that this happened with our first Gravity delivered in June, as someone at Lucid admitted to me that checking that navigation systems were functioning only started after that car was shipped, and there was absolutely no way its badly distorted HUD screen was not noticed on the factory test circuit.)

His only escape from personal responsibility would be if the Board overrode him and insisted that deliveries start when they did.

The price Lucid paid is that almost every major automotive award passed the Gravity by, major reviewers have discussed at length the plethora of software glitches, and a company that engineers the best and most efficient driving machines and passenger conveyances on the planet is mostly talked about for its software incompetence.

While true, they were also in a bad position of having ALREADY had to put a hold on further deliveries for like 8 months or something, taking a big hit to the reputation of Lucid and the Gravity, and pissing off long-time order placers, risking that more and more of them would cancel their orders. Delaying another 4-6 months (bleeding money and desperate for revenue) would have made that even worse.

Catch-22. Do you go ahead and release it so people can get 80% of the goodness but suffer with 20% badness, or do you keep extended an already disastrous long delay? Not sure there is a "right" choice in that equation. It's lose-lose either way.

 

[dbsb3233]

I have no inside info whatsoever but from what I've read here and on other forums it would seem that things are actually improving under Winterhoff's leadership.
I kind of felt sorry for the guy after speaking with him at length at the SJ SC grand opening event about the key fob issues. I gathered Lucid just went with the fob manufacturer that Mercedes was using and didn't expect all the implementation issues.
Maybe it is on Lucid to oversee implementation of these things better and ensure stuff is working properly before releasing Gravity so who knows?
All I know is that my gut feeling is that this company does seem to "own it" & "lean in" and not deflect and deny and have that "we got your money for the sale so screw you now" attitude. Hoping for smoother sailing ahead.

I just watched a video on battery replacement of the fob to see which one to throw in the car as an extra just in case. The guy measured his original fob battery at just 2.7v. The replacement was like 3.3v. I wonder if it's that simple... they used a batch of weak batteries in the first place and they just need replacing?

 

[hmp10]

While true, they were also in a bad position of having ALREADY had to put a hold on further deliveries for like 8 months or something, taking a big hit to the reputation of Lucid and the Gravity, and pissing off long-time order placers, risking that more and more of them would cancel their orders. Delaying another 4-6 months (bleeding money and desperate for revenue) would have made that even worse.

Catch-22. Do you go ahead and release it so people can get 80% of the goodness but suffer with 20% badness, or do you keep extended an already disastrous long delay? Not sure there is a "right" choice in that equation. It's lose-lose either way.

It may be the difference between long-term and short-term damage. A further delay -- which is common to so many EV introductions (including Tesla) -- would eventually fade into memory, especially if the Gravity eventually picked up the kind of awards and recognition many thought it would and that the Air picked up.

But once a reputation for poor quality in some key aspect of a car sets in, those impressions have a much longer half-life. This is especially the case with Lucid coming on the heels of the software issues that accompanied the original Air release. Even on things as basic and as critical as being able to get into the car and start it up, Lucid is now batting 0-for-2. It's not a good look.