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No point made nor intended. Just reporting some numbers I saw in publication which were new to me.
Marc Winteroff out
- Thread starter gaskiller
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Probably in Saudi Arabia if that's where they're going to build the Cosmos
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I have a Tesla, Rivan and Lucid.
Rivian: SiriusXM dropouts as well. I think slightly more frequent than Lucid Air with the 2.9.0 software.
Tesla: Use Apple Music in the Tesla app. Works well. But that's different, not live radio. It's streaming, so you can buffer songs ahead. Do not subscribe to SiriusXM on Tesla.
The EV makers are taking a streaming forward approach to satellite radio, which has pluses and minuses. On the plus side, the streaming version of SiriusXM offers higher-bit-rate, higher-quality audio. On the downside, it needs cell service.
I only have Tesla and Lucid and Lucids connectivity for Sirius is better than Tesla for Music.
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This is incorrect. Per Lucid's 10-K, as of December 31, 2026, they had "approximately 9,000 employees globally." If they trimmed 1,386 employees subsequent to this and then another 18% of what remained, they would have 6,244 employees, asssuming that they did zero hiring, which is not the case. Lucid is regularly hiring new employees. Case in point, there are approximately 200 open roles currently being advertised on Lucid's job site alone.
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Lucid continues to make strategic hires for AMP-2. It makes sense to reduce staff for AMP-1 if it’s only focus for now is low volume Air & Gravity. I’m sure when cosmos production begins at AMP-1, we will see hiring for a 2nd shift again.
Reports suggest they are hiring at AMP-2 in Saudi Arabia, where Cosmos will be produced for probably the first year at least.
Lucid Expands AMP-2 and Hiring in Saudi Arabia
Lucid is entering an exciting new chapter in Saudi Arabia. We’re taking our manufacturing facility in King Abdullah Economic City (KAEC), AMP-2, from initial assembly to full production.
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Well, those numbers come directly from SFGate, so feel free to correct them.
Most of the chatter on this site pertains to issues with fobs, charging, DDPro, OTA issues, etc.
Since they laid off 319 at Newark in February, which of the 14 new hires do you anticipate to work on those issues? Or will the listed 48 Middle East hourly workers take that on?
Gross hiring numbers I find to be largely uninformative and potentially irrelevant.
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Just for comparison:
Rivian : 15532 employees as of last quarter, approximately 42247 deliveries, $5.5B revenue TTM, $353k rev per employee, guidance for ~65K deliveries, just laid off 2%, $3.868B SG&A and R&D Fixed costs.
Lucid: 6500 employees after the cuts, assume another +10% hiring in KSA, approximately 15841 Deliveries, $1.4B revenue TTM, $155K rev per employee (pre-layoffs), $263k after, guidance probably going to the lowest of 21K, $2.4B in SG&A and R&D fixed costs.
Point is at their stage they do have more people than car deliveries and revenue, even with really good growth their is spending ahead of reality...Mostly you would hire slightly later than revenue even if it causes some pain and customer experience issues with service.
Ferrari is another publicly traded small volume pure automaker, they had just 5432 employees for 13K deliveries.
Rivian : 15532 employees as of last quarter, approximately 42247 deliveries, $5.5B revenue TTM, $353k rev per employee, guidance for ~65K deliveries, just laid off 2%, $3.868B SG&A and R&D Fixed costs.
Lucid: 6500 employees after the cuts, assume another +10% hiring in KSA, approximately 15841 Deliveries, $1.4B revenue TTM, $155K rev per employee (pre-layoffs), $263k after, guidance probably going to the lowest of 21K, $2.4B in SG&A and R&D fixed costs.
Point is at their stage they do have more people than car deliveries and revenue, even with really good growth their is spending ahead of reality...Mostly you would hire slightly later than revenue even if it causes some pain and customer experience issues with service.
Ferrari is another publicly traded small volume pure automaker, they had just 5432 employees for 13K deliveries.
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Thanks for this rundown and perspective.
My opinion (only) is all over the map. I want them to preserve core competence in Newark, but also retain and grow service. But the company needs more revenue which means build more cars, so hire hourly (esp in KSA).
So this is how terrible I would be at their business by moving exactly in the apparent opposite direction. In the 10-K under Risks, they are keenly aware of the damage of hiring and then releasing talent, especially in the long term and reputationally in the future pool. Losing top technical leadership is profoundly damaging; reference the earlier discussion about Steve Jobs and the position Apple was in after the board dumped him, then frantically worked to recover from that mistake.
It is interesting to see from your post exactly where Lucid places
Now this is very interesting to me. I wonder what their dealer and service footprint is like compared to Lucid? Lucid is selling roughtly twice the cars with about the same staff, but the margin on Ferrari is huge comparitively. Ferrari isn't exactly a tech powerhouse either.
and we don't talk about Ferrari's EV....
Yeah, if they don’t intend to produce cosmos, no point having 2nd shift. The more they overproduce, the more incentives they need to give to sell. Aligning production to demand is smart. Past C-suite just wanted to reach production goals with no clear plan on financials.
Ferrari makes 50% margins…..that’s the difference.
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And ESS! That’s a huge market opportunity that their technology is well suited to address. Need to figure out the car business first so likely doesn’t get picked up until 2030+.
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Both Gravity and Air are located in the smaller cohort of new cars that are this big. The big sellers are compact SUVs and for whatever reason, Lucid has not yet entered that market. At one point it was fairly empty; now the cohort is filled. Hyundai Ioniq5, Kia EV6, Genesis GV60 and GV70, BMW IX (although a bit large for this group), Mercedes B series SUVs, Polestar 3 and 4, Chevrolet Equinox, Ford Mach-E, etc. When the Cosmos is released, it will have a lot of competition.
Peter delayed the original Gravity by a year to redesign so it had its own platform instead of using the Air. The delay and added expense contributed to present situation. By the the time the Gravity came out, EV incentives disappeared and now struggling to get a foothold. This is what happens when you have an engineer as CEO. (BTW, Musk is not a real engineer so not a comparison.) The Gravity delay, delayed the Cosmos. You can make the best engineered car but you need financial acumen. Of course software neglect didn’t help. Now they have software much improved, but damage has been done. Anywhere you look, outside of owners, it’s “ Lucid software sucks”
See now this is confusing to me.
Market: we like compact SUVs but miss big storage
Lucid: here is a compact SUV with big storage!
Market: eww. Mini van.
There’s just no pleasing them!
That's not the market, it's (mostly) Tesla fanatics.
The market actually likes minivans. Or at least vehicles with ample interior space and storage (thus the popularity of SUVs).
I don't think the Cosmos is "too late". The reason there's so many compact-to-medium SUVs and crossovers is that that's where most of the buyers are. More buyers = more models.
The most prominent thing that keeps the Air and Gravity from being far bigger sellers is price. Most people simply can't afford (or justify) $80k+ vehicles. If the Gravity sold for $40k instead of $100k, they'd sell like hotcakes. (Or more aptly, like RAV4's).