Lucid Nav Trip Charging Planning - better than most?

[doubletwist]

I'm looking to possibly drive from DFW to Las Vegas next month and it got me wondering how the built in Nav would do compared to ABRP's "Optimal" setting.

The built in Nav did fine on my trip up to NY in December but didn't feel overly optimized, seeming to suggest more stops than necessary, and not in a "charge shallow, charge quick" kind of way.

Generally I like ABRP's Optimised method. It seems to avoid overly long charge sessions, but doesn't have me stopping so often that it gets annoying.

Plus I feel it can sometimes get to the point where I feel I'm losing more time getting off the highway and finding the station than I'm gaining by doing a shorter charge when I use the more stops/"fastest" mode.

The results today comparing the two surprised me - the actual stations chosen differed a little bit, but they both estimated 9 charging stops, and the total charging time (~3hrs) was nearly the same, and estimated overall drive time only differed by about 30 minutes (21h15m Lucid vs 21h48min ABRP)!

That's pretty close for a 1200+ mile trip.

The both were pretty heavy on EA, and Pilot Flying J, stations, with a couple Francis Energy stops and an IONNA . All decent looking stations, nothing dumb like a slow/blocked dealership stop it anything.

I know I read a lot of horror stories about other carmakers built in Nav not doing a good job of planning charging stops for long trips, but Lucid's seems to have improved quite a bit. To the point where I'm not sure I'll even bother with ABRP unless I suddenly feel I really need to.

I will definitely still check all the stops on Plugshare though!

 

[DeaneG]

On a recent trip, I found Gravity's built-in nav did a pretty good job of route planning. But when we were still 30-60 minutes from the car's intended charging target, my wife used her phone to check on charging station availability, and to decide if there was a better location further along our track. Gravity seemed a bit conservative - and also we were caught in rush hour traffic, so we spent less energy than the route planner initially predicted. Sometimes we'd cancel the route midway through and restart it to get a revised charging plan.

 

[Coyote]

I find the built in Nav perfectly acceptable. I have not done any longer trips yet, but i have routed a couple just to see what it came up with. It did well. It is very easy to modify charging stops along the way, so if you prefer Tesla to EA for example, you can easily make the change if there is one along your route. I would much rather have the Nav system a bit conservative rather than get stranded somewhere.

As a pilot, I am used to planning routes based on fuel stops, and I see this as not that different.

 

[illopp00]

You can change all the routing settings the same as ABRP: less stops but longer stops, optimize for time, more stops but shorter. Arrival SOC, charger SOC. Also filter out certain networks. I use the Lucid NAV on long road trips it's really good.

 

[Saksak]

I used the Gravity’s built-in NAV for a 2000 mile road trip (round trip) and was quite happy with it.

The best thing about it was that the charge estimate at destination was excellent, taking into account elevation changes (you can see this in the charge->usage->route display). Typical charge estimate deviation is within a few percent from the beginning of the trip to the end, with the estimate “locking in” the closer you get. The range spider on the NAV display was also useful.

You do have to take into account weather, though, as efficiency can drop 10% to 15% in rain. On one leg of the trip, my initial SOC estimate at destination was 15% but eventually dropped to 8% as I hit a long stretch of heavy rain. I expected this so it was not a problem. I also had a backup charger planned in case the destination SOC dropped under 5%.

ABRP didn’t do any better as its SOC estimate was always off, even with my live data subscription. I did use ABRP to look up charger ratings and amenities such as food, bathrooms, etc. If Lucid is able to supply that information in the built-in NAV, I would ditch all external apps.

 

[doubletwist]

You can change all the routing settings the same as ABRP: less stops but longer stops, optimize for time, more stops but shorter. Arrival SOC, charger SOC. Also filter out certain networks. I use the Lucid NAV on long road trips it's really good.

The only customization I have on the Air is the minimum kW level of charger, and toggling off certain charger brands.

 

[doubletwist]

You can change all the routing settings the same as ABRP: less stops but longer stops, optimize for time, more stops but shorter. Arrival SOC, charger SOC. Also filter out certain networks. I use the Lucid NAV on long road trips it's really good.

You're going to have to tell me how to do that because I've never seen that anywhere. Unless that's something in the 3.x UI on the Gravity that isn't yet available in the Air.

 

[Jayman]

Not sure what other’s experience has been, but I’ve found the Air Nav to be horrible. Often takes me the wrong way and is very inaccurate. I’ve had to use my Apple Maps on CarPlay to get where I need to go. Just my experience.

 

[doubletwist]

Not sure what other’s experience has been, but I’ve found the Air Nav to be horrible. Often takes me the wrong way and is very inaccurate. I’ve had to use my Apple Maps on CarPlay to get where I need to go. Just my experience.

I guess I could have been clearer in my original post. I agree that for around town navigating and trying to go to a particular address or business, it is still pretty hit or miss.

My post was focusing on long trip and charging planning, which seems to now be pretty close to on par with ABRP's Optimal setting.

 

[DeaneG]

IIRC the Air's nav currently does not have settings for charge level at charging stops and intermediate destinations. Gravity does.

 

[BS8899]

I'm looking to possibly drive from DFW to Las Vegas next month and it got me wondering how the built in Nav would do compared to ABRP's "Optimal" setting.

The built in Nav did fine on my trip up to NY in December but didn't feel overly optimized, seeming to suggest more stops than necessary, and not in a "charge shallow, charge quick" kind of way.

Generally I like ABRP's Optimised method. It seems to avoid overly long charge sessions, but doesn't have me stopping so often that it gets annoying.

Plus I feel it can sometimes get to the point where I feel I'm losing more time getting off the highway and finding the station than I'm gaining by doing a shorter charge when I use the more stops/"fastest" mode.

The results today comparing the two surprised me - the actual stations chosen differed a little bit, but they both estimated 9 charging stops, and the total charging time (~3hrs) was nearly the same, and estimated overall drive time only differed by about 30 minutes (21h15m Lucid vs 21h48min ABRP)!

That's pretty close for a 1200+ mile trip.

The both were pretty heavy on EA, and Pilot Flying J, stations, with a couple Francis Energy stops and an IONNA . All decent looking stations, nothing dumb like a slow/blocked dealership stop it anything.

I know I read a lot of horror stories about other carmakers built in Nav not doing a good job of planning charging stops for long trips, but Lucid's seems to have improved quite a bit. To the point where I'm not sure I'll even bother with ABRP unless I suddenly feel I really need to.

I will definitely still check all the stops on Plugshare though!

Does your Air Touring have NASC or J1772?

 

[doubletwist]

Does your Air Touring have NASC or J1772?

None of the Airs have native NACS.

I do have both the L2 and DC NACS adapters but I've never used either one, I just have them for emergencies.

 

[BS8899]

None of the Airs have native NACS.

I do have both the L2 and DC NACS adapters but I've never used either one, I just have them for emergencies.

When I drive long distances, I typically use EA for my Lucid and Rivian's Adventure Network for my Rivian. The EA chargers are 350kW and the Rivian chargers are 300kW. My experience is that the Rivian Adventure chargers (charging the Rivian R1S) are better in that they typically deliver 250kW whilst the EA (350kW, charging the AGT) chargers barely reach 200kW and only sustained for a few minutes before it drops to below 200kW. I should try to charge my AGT on the Rivian chargers and see how that performs.

 

[DeaneG]

When I drive long distances, I typically use EA for my Lucid and Rivian's Adventure Network for my Rivian. The EA chargers are 350kW and the Rivian chargers are 300kW. My experience is that the Rivian Adventure chargers (charging the Rivian R1S) are better in that they typically deliver 250kW whilst the EA (350kW, charging the AGT) chargers barely reach 200kW and only sustained for a few minutes before it drops to below 200kW. I should try to charge my AGT on the Rivian chargers and see how that performs.

Either charger network will work fine with either vehicle, as will Ionna, Shell Recharge, EVGo, etc.

 

[AwlBidnz]

I'm looking to possibly drive from DFW to Las Vegas next month and it got me wondering how the built in Nav would do compared to ABRP's "Optimal" setting.

The built in Nav did fine on my trip up to NY in December but didn't feel overly optimized, seeming to suggest more stops than necessary, and not in a "charge shallow, charge quick" kind of way.

Generally I like ABRP's Optimised method. It seems to avoid overly long charge sessions, but doesn't have me stopping so often that it gets annoying.

Plus I feel it can sometimes get to the point where I feel I'm losing more time getting off the highway and finding the station than I'm gaining by doing a shorter charge when I use the more stops/"fastest" mode.

The results today comparing the two surprised me - the actual stations chosen differed a little bit, but they both estimated 9 charging stops, and the total charging time (~3hrs) was nearly the same, and estimated overall drive time only differed by about 30 minutes (21h15m Lucid vs 21h48min ABRP)!

That's pretty close for a 1200+ mile trip.

The both were pretty heavy on EA, and Pilot Flying J, stations, with a couple Francis Energy stops and an IONNA . All decent looking stations, nothing dumb like a slow/blocked dealership stop it anything.

I know I read a lot of horror stories about other carmakers built in Nav not doing a good job of planning charging stops for long trips, but Lucid's seems to have improved quite a bit. To the point where I'm not sure I'll even bother with ABRP unless I suddenly feel I really need to.

I will definitely still check all the stops on Plugshare though!

In the part of the country you are driving, I suggest you check any Francis charger locations to make sure they have been updated to Tesla v.4 units. Our recent trip west & back (5.5kmi) was NAV flawless EXCEPT for one “off ramp/on ramp”direction it flipped out. We assumed it was just checking to see if we were paying attention as it showed the silly maneuver on the screen

 

[Saksak]

[…]. Our recent trip west & back (5.5kmi) was NAV flawless EXCEPT for one “off ramp/on ramp”direction it flipped out. We assumed it was just checking to see if we were paying attention as it showed the silly maneuver on the screen

I should point out that I also experienced this many times in my Gravity, but only once during a critical navigation point where I needed directions (I took a best guess and, luckily, I guessed correctly and NAV found itself before my next turn). Be prepared for dropouts. I filed the following bug report (photo and videos not included here).

3.5.1 bug: Navigation looses track of position

In this picture, we were traveling on I-5. Navigation suddenly thought we were on the on-ramp.

In this video, navigation suddenly thought we were in the oncoming lane, rerouted, and then jumped us back to the proper lane.

I can provide additional videos and timestamps if needed.

 

[illopp00]

You're going to have to tell me how to do that because I've never seen that anywhere. Unless that's something in the 3.x UI on the Gravity that isn't yet available in the Air.

Sorry yes its a Gravity/UX3.0 Charging app capability. The thread title was sort of all encompassing....I took 2300 mi road trip in my Air Touring and the first leg I planned with ABRP and got almost the same results as my Air native NAV, so some of the underlying routing algo must be almost the same, you just can't configure it in detail yet.

 

[Bob Lahblaw]

I did a quick search in the forum to try to find an answer, but search results didn't help. So will try asking here:

Does the Lucid route planner provide the option to change the minimum charge for needing a charging station? Currently, it appears to default to between 10-20% for adding a charging stop. But if one wanted to be conservative (and provide a buffer, in case the recommended charging location is a fail), can one change the default to, say, 25% minimum charge?

 

[doubletwist]

I did a quick search in the forum to try to find an answer, but search results didn't help. So will try asking here:

Does the Lucid route planner provide the option to change the minimum charge for needing a charging station? Currently, it appears to default to between 10-20% for adding a charging stop. But if one wanted to be conservative (and provide a buffer, in case the recommended charging location is a fail), can one change the default to, say, 25% minimum charge?

Sadly, no, not yet. At least not in the Air which is still on 2.x. I don't know if the updated 3.x UI from the Gravity (and which the Air will get later this summer/fall - in theory) allows for that.

 

[Saksak]

Does the Lucid route planner provide the option to change the minimum charge for needing a charging station?

For the Gravity, yes. There are two settings, one for the minimum charge at charging stations and one for the destination.