Apple CarPlay vs Tidal

[SaratogaLefty]

First of all let me say that I am thrilled that Apple CarPlay has finally arrived. There are lots of features I really like but I do have some questions for the audiophiles here regarding how it compares with Tidal. I have an extensive Dolby Atmos Playlist on Tidal (over 700 songs) and also a Dolby Atmos Playlist on Apple Music (over 1400 songs). I have only used Apple CarPlay thus far wirelessly in the Lucid but I have noticed a few things:

1. In Tidal it identifies when it is playing a Dolby Atmos recording when it shows the artwork but Apple Music does not so far as I can tell.

2. In Tidal, the EQ functions in the Lucid menu are totally greyed out and I understand why that is the case from other postings on this forum. However, when playing Dolby Atmos in Apple Music the EQ functions are still available??

3. In Tidal, I can pull down to the Pilot panel and see my entire Playlist recordings and then jump wherever I choose or just let it shuffle. Apple Music does have a shuffle function but I can't view the entire playlist or pull it down to the pilot panel.

The sound from Apple Music via CarPlay does sound quite good but I do think the Tidal sounds a little better?? Its early since I just downloaded CarPlay last night and I haven't tried wired yet, but I'm curious what the true audiophiles on this forum think??

 

[Uff-da]

I'd love to be making such comparisons myself. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting for the download.

 

[Alex]

First of all let me say that I am thrilled that Apple CarPlay has finally arrived. There are lots of features I really like but I do have some questions for the audiophiles here regarding how it compares with Tidal. I have an extensive Dolby Atmos Playlist on Tidal (over 700 songs) and also a Dolby Atmos Playlist on Apple Music (over 1400 songs). I have only used Apple CarPlay thus far wirelessly in the Lucid but I have noticed a few things:

1. In Tidal it identifies when it is playing a Dolby Atmos recording when it shows the artwork but Apple Music does not so far as I can tell.

2. In Tidal, the EQ functions in the Lucid menu are totally greyed out and I understand why that is the case from other postings on this forum. However, when playing Dolby Atmos in Apple Music the EQ functions are still available??

3. In Tidal, I can pull down to the Pilot panel and see my entire Playlist recordings and then jump wherever I choose or just let it shuffle. Apple Music does have a shuffle function but I can't view the entire playlist or pull it down to the pilot panel.

The sound from Apple Music via CarPlay does sound quite good but I do think the Tidal sounds a little better?? Its early since I just downloaded CarPlay last night and I haven't tried wired yet, but I'm curious what the true audiophiles on this forum think??

How about you play the Dolby Atmos Demo which tests the speaker separation, which should at least let you know if there is Dolby Atmos decoding going on? I would try this, but I’m still waiting for the CarPlay download.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

Well I now believe there is little difference between wireless and wired. Further I can definitely hear a significant difference between the Tidal App in the Lucid UI vs Apple Music through CarPlay. I do not believe the dolby atmos is coming through on Apple CarPlay.

 

[MorganB]

I just installed the CarPlay update. Sadly there is no Atmos in Apple Music via CarPlay. When I initiate playback of an Atmos track on my iPhone while connected to CarPlay, the Atmos indicator disappears. As soon as I unplug the phone it reappears. There is no mention of Atmos in the Music app on the CarPlay screen. It's also evident audibly as SaratogaLefty describes. I have a suspicion that this is a limitation in the current version of CarPlay. I have emailed Lucid requesting that they add an Apple Music App with Atmos support to their UI natively has Mercedes Benz did last year.

Apple Music and Mercedes-Benz bring immersive Spatial Audio to drivers worldwide

Apple Music’s highly acclaimed Spatial Audio with support for Dolby Atmos is now available as a native experience in Mercedes-Benz vehicles.

www.apple.com

I don't know if this is possible as perhaps Lucid has an exclusivity contract with Lucid for a certain period of time or perhaps MB has an Atmos Apple Music exclusivity contract with Apple but its worth sending it in as a suggestion. Looks like we are stuck with Tidal if we want Atmos. I basically listen to Atmos exclusively.

Those that care about Apple Music with Atmos in Lucid should email as well.

 

[Bill55]

The Apple news release for Atmos for MB makes no mention of CarPlay.

Apple Music and Mercedes-Benz bring immersive Spatial Audio to drivers worldwide

Apple Music’s highly acclaimed Spatial Audio with support for Dolby Atmos is now available as a native experience in Mercedes-Benz vehicles.

www.apple.com

 

[MorganB]

The Apple news release for Atmos for MB makes no mention of CarPlay.

Apple Music and Mercedes-Benz bring immersive Spatial Audio to drivers worldwide

Apple Music’s highly acclaimed Spatial Audio with support for Dolby Atmos is now available as a native experience in Mercedes-Benz vehicles.

www.apple.com

Correct. That was Apple Music with Atmos in a MB UI native app which is what we need for Lucid.

 

[joec]

Correct. That was Apple Music with Atmos in a MB UI native app which is what we need for Lucid.

Or we need CarPlay to play Atmos tracks. My guess is that will be coming eventually. When is anyone’s guess.

 

[MorganB]

Or we need CarPlay to play Atmos tracks. My guess is that will be coming eventually. When is anyone’s guess.

I do not believe that CarPlay in its current form from Apple supports Atmos. I believe this is an Apple limitation rather than a Lucid limitation.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

I like the idea suggested by MorganB to get an Apple Music dedicated app installed on the car ASAP! I am happy we finally have CarPlay available for a number of reasons, but the availability of Atmos tracks in Apple Music was my number one request.

 

[Bill55]

I do not believe that CarPlay in its current form from Apple supports Atmos. I believe this is an Apple limitation rather than a Lucid limitation.

I would agree. Limited number of cars that support Atmos right now.

Dolby Atmos is currently available on the Lucid Air and Mercedes-Maybach S-Class, as well as the Mercedes-Benz S-Class, EQE, EQE SUV, EQS and EQS SUV. Volvo has already announced that Atmos will be available on the Bowers & Wilkins sound system in the EX90 SUV.

 

[joec]

I do not believe that CarPlay in its current form from Apple supports Atmos. I believe this is an Apple limitation rather than a Lucid limitation.

Right. But there’s no reason Apple can’t support Atmos in CarPlay. It’s surprising they don’t, given how much they are pushing Spatial Audio.

Why would they want to build a proprietary Apple Music app for every car company when they could just add this feature to their existing CarPlay infrasructure?

 

[joec]

The entire point of the CarPlay project was to get a unified experience in every car for Apple users. Dolby Atmos in cars is so new and rare it probably didn’t register as important to the team yet. But now that we’re seeing more Atmos car systems installed, I’m guessing Apple will respond quickly.

 

[MorganB]

The entire point of the CarPlay project was to get a unified experience in every car for Apple users. Dolby Atmos in cars is so new and rare it probably didn’t register as important to the team yet. But now that we’re seeing more Atmos car systems installed, I’m guessing Apple will respond quickly.

Perhaps in that new new version of CarPlay coming later this year they will but I doubt they will add it to the current version since it is headed out and Mercedes already has an integrated solution for Apple Music with Atmos. Apple would be developing and implementing Dolby Atmos in CarPlay solely for the Lucid Air and the forth coming Volvo EX90.

I think a quicker solution for Atmos from Apple Music would be a native Lucid UI App.

 

[joec]

Perhaps in that new new version of CarPlay coming later this year they will but I doubt they will add it to the current version since it is headed out and Mercedes already has an integrated solution for Apple Music with Atmos. Apple would be developing and implementing Dolby Atmos in CarPlay solely for the Lucid Air and the forth coming Volvo EX90.

I think a quicker solution for Atmos from Apple Music would be a native Lucid UI App.

You think building an entire app for one car would be easier than adding an output capability to an existing app that would benefit any future cars that incorporate Atmos?

Don’t get me wrong. I’d love to see a dedicated Apple Music app in the Lucid for those who want it. But it’s undoubtedly better time and money spent for Apple if they just add it to CarPlay.

 

[MorganB]

You think building an entire app for one car would be easier than adding an output capability to an existing app that would benefit any future cars that incorporate Atmos?

I was actually thinking that Lucid would be the one developing the Apple Music App under Apple Music API developer guidelines. However to your point it could require development from Apple as well. If Apple has to spend dev time to implement Atmos in CarPlay or assist in development of a native Lucid App the benefits are limited for Apple as the Lucid Air is the only car on the road that supports Atmos that does not have Apple Music Atmos available. Next year Volvo will launch one vehicle as you pointed out and Lucid will theoretically launch the Gravity. It's a very very small market unfortunately so I think most of the heavy lifting will be on Lucid's shoulders. Early on Lucid opted to partner with Tidal which could be a stumbling block with Apple if Lucid is under some sort of contract with Tidal.

 

[joec]

I was actually thinking that Lucid would be the one developing the Apple Music App under Apple Music API developer guidelines. However to your point it could require development from Apple as well. If Apple has to spend dev time to implement Atmos in CarPlay or assist in development of a native Lucid App the benefits are limited for Apple as the Lucid Air is the only car on the road that supports Atmos that does not have Apple Music Atmos available. Next year Volvo will launch one vehicle as you pointed out and Lucid will theoretically launch the Gravity. It's a very very small market unfortunately so I think most of the heavy lifting will be on Lucid's shoulders. Early on Lucid opted to partner with Tidal which could be a stumbling block with Apple if Lucid is under some sort of contract with Tidal.

I'm not sure where the burden for development would lie. But my guess is Apple would need to be involved, regardless. There aren't open APIs available to a car company to simply tap into Apple Music. And for branding purposes, Apple wouldn't allow Lucid to just build an app on their own accord without any sort of UI guidance.

I never got a full answer, but I was asking around when Tesla released its Apple Music app as to who actually built it. The impression I got from friends is that it was a mostly Apple-led effort, with help from Tesla to get it integrated. Which is why that app looks and feels like the standard Apple Music app. (Unfortunately, Tesla decided to limit the bandwidth on that app, so the sound quality isn't great. And it tends to cut out or stall in downloading tracks. Speculation is that this is typical cost-cutting for Tesla, since they have many customers still on free data for life plans.

Not sure who built the Mercedes app, either. But if I had to guess, Apple developers were heavily involved.

The Tesla app made sense for Apple to spend the effort, since there's no way Tesla is ever going to incorporate CarPlay. The Mercedes situation is strange to me. They have CarPlay already, so why not just put Atmos in CarPlay? Maybe you are correct that this would be the better route from Apple's perspective?

It's possible the CarPlay team was busy with all the big 2.0 stuff at the time, and the Apple Music app team was brought in to help out Mercedes instead.

I'd love to have a little birdie on the inside of CarPlay to find out what their thinking is on all this stuff. From a logical standpoint, I look at Apple Music, which has the largest selection of Atmos tracks in its library. I look at Apple's goal for CarPlay, which is to be the standard infotainment interface of every car, essentially. And I look at a small but steadily growing number of cars being offered with Atmos-capable systems. To me, everything points in the direction of adding Atmos to CarPlay. At least long term. But maybe they will build one or two more proprietary apps in the meantime?

As someone who likes CarPlay for maps. it sure would be odd and inconvenient to have to drop out of CarPlay to adjust my music in the "native" Apple Music app, then jump back to CarPlay.

 

[MorganB]

I'm not sure where the burden for development would lie. But my guess is Apple would need to be involved, regardless. There aren't open APIs available to a car company to simply tap into Apple Music. And for branding purposes, Apple wouldn't allow Lucid to just build an app on their own accord without any sort of UI guidance.

I never got a full answer, but I was asking around when Tesla released its Apple Music app as to who actually built it. The impression I got from friends is that it was a mostly Apple-led effort, with help from Tesla to get it integrated. Which is why that app looks and feels like the standard Apple Music app. (Unfortunately, Tesla decided to limit the bandwidth on that app, so the sound quality isn't great. And it tends to cut out or stall in downloading tracks. Speculation is that this is typical cost-cutting for Tesla, since they have many customers still on free data for life plans.

Not sure who built the Mercedes app, either. But if I had to guess, Apple developers were heavily involved.

The Tesla app made sense for Apple to spend the effort, since there's no way Tesla is ever going to incorporate CarPlay. The Mercedes situation is strange to me. They have CarPlay already, so why not just put Atmos in CarPlay? Maybe you are correct that this would be the better route from Apple's perspective?

It's possible the CarPlay team was busy with all the big 2.0 stuff at the time, and the Apple Music app team was brought in to help out Mercedes instead.

I'd love to have a little birdie on the inside of CarPlay to find out what their thinking is on all this stuff. From a logical standpoint, I look at Apple Music, which has the largest selection of Atmos tracks in its library. I look at Apple's goal for CarPlay, which is to be the standard infotainment interface of every car, essentially. And I look at a small but steadily growing number of cars being offered with Atmos-capable systems. To me, everything points in the direction of adding Atmos to CarPlay. At least long term. But maybe they will build one or two more proprietary apps in the meantime?

As someone who likes CarPlay for maps. it sure would be odd and inconvenient to have to drop out of CarPlay to adjust my music in the "native" Apple Music app, then jump back to CarPlay.

All very very good points and info. I wish I had a little birdie inside Apple also! Perhaps Lucid should gift the first Sapphire off the line to Tim Cook haha. I do see your point about CarPlay implementation and bouncing back and forth. I actually like the Lucid interface and it gets the job done for me so I will probably continue to use it mostly. I do like maps in CarPlay but since it doesn't offer SOC currently I will probably continue to use the Lucid Nav. I am personally obsessed with Atmos so I will also continue to use Tidal. Choice is the best option so maybe someday we will have a fully fleshed out CarPlay as well as a native Apple Music app and multi screen functionality in the Lucid UI. Lucid implementing CarPlay is a step in the right direction