If leasing is not available, would you cancel your Gravity order?

If leasing is not available, would you cancel your Gravity order?

  • Yes

    Votes: 41 66.1%
  • No

    Votes: 21 33.9%

  • Total voters
    62
I posted this message in the Lucid Gravity Lease vs. Finance thread, but I'm posting here in order to get additional responses.

And I'm posting this additional paragraph to make clear the intent and tone of my post.
I know the tone of text-based messages can't always be communicated, but I want to do so.
I, in no way, am intending to minimize the lease experience or criticize those who choose to lease.
We're all adults and make decisions that work for our lives.
Hopefully, my post is of interest to others who've had the same questions.

I think I've had a coming to Jesus (aka "be honest with yourself") moment.
I've watched this thread and other leasing-related threads as part of learning the intricacies of car leasing.
I've known the basics of car leasing for some time, but never had the need or desire to delve in deeper for better understanding in order to seriously consider it until my decision a couple of years ago to get a new car in 2025. Learning about EVs has been enlightening enough and gaining knowledge of the leasing experience has been fascinating.

@PetevB and anyone else who has responded to any of my posts about leasing, I appreciate your input. I welcome input that challenges my thinking. I consider myself a lifelong learner.

I'm just an "owning" type person.
I like having my own stuff and the experience of taking care of it.
The cars I've owned over the years had memories attached to them; sentimental value.
I keep them until I determine it is no longer economically feasible to do so. A key decision for me moving forward considering the eventual need for battery replacement or whatever is possible in the future.
Financially, Leashackr and every analysis I've done, indicates ownership is best for me.
As the Seinfeld cast would say "yada yada yada". I'll spare you the details of my story.
Now to my questions, for those willing to respond.

For those of you who know you're just a "leasing" type person, for whatever reason; most common I've heard is the desire to drive something new every 3 years or so:

  1. During your leasing experiences, does brand loyalty ever impact your decision? i.e. do you plan to stay with a Lucid with your future leases or are you hopeful to one day "own" a Lucid?
  2. A car is just a physical item, but do you ever develop any type of attachment to the car your leasing or is it just a resource to be used until you move on to the next resource? Customizations are limited, so there's not much that can be done to make the car personalized to you, if that is even desired.
  3. The excitement around the release of the Air and now the Gravity, at the end of your lease do you carry that emotion on to the next car you're interesting in leasing?
  4. What would change you from being a leasing type person to the owning type?
  5. Considering the issues discussed on this forum that relate to driving an Air and so-to-be Gravity, how does leasing impact your response when issues are encountered, considered your driving experience is finite based on the lease term? A person financing a car has to consider the financial impact of depreciation; you're spared that dilemma.
 
That credit is a ticking time bomb and the longer Lucid drags its feet getting cars delivered the less time people will have the opportunity to access the credit and possibly forced to go with another brand. It’s no doubt helped move the Air leasing along.
Can’t get the credit anyway. Don’t qualify.
 
I posted this message in the Lucid Gravity Lease vs. Finance thread, but I'm posting here in order to get additional responses.

And I'm posting this additional paragraph to make clear the intent and tone of my post.
I know the tone of text-based messages can't always be communicated, but I want to do so.
I, in no way, am intending to minimize the lease experience or criticize those who choose to lease.
We're all adults and make decisions that work for our lives.
Hopefully, my post is of interest to others who've had the same questions.

I think I've had a coming to Jesus (aka "be honest with yourself") moment.
I've watched this thread and other leasing-related threads as part of learning the intricacies of car leasing.
I've known the basics of car leasing for some time, but never had the need or desire to delve in deeper for better understanding in order to seriously consider it until my decision a couple of years ago to get a new car in 2025. Learning about EVs has been enlightening enough and gaining knowledge of the leasing experience has been fascinating.

@PetevB and anyone else who has responded to any of my posts about leasing, I appreciate your input. I welcome input that challenges my thinking. I consider myself a lifelong learner.

I'm just an "owning" type person.
I like having my own stuff and the experience of taking care of it.
The cars I've owned over the years had memories attached to them; sentimental value.
I keep them until I determine it is no longer economically feasible to do so. A key decision for me moving forward considering the eventual need for battery replacement or whatever is possible in the future.
Financially, Leashackr and every analysis I've done, indicates ownership is best for me.
As the Seinfeld cast would say "yada yada yada". I'll spare you the details of my story.
Now to my questions, for those willing to respond.

For those of you who know you're just a "leasing" type person, for whatever reason; most common I've heard is the desire to drive something new every 3 years or so:

  1. During your leasing experiences, does brand loyalty ever impact your decision? i.e. do you plan to stay with a Lucid with your future leases or are you hopeful to one day "own" a Lucid?
  2. A car is just a physical item, but do you ever develop any type of attachment to the car your leasing or is it just a resource to be used until you move on to the next resource? Customizations are limited, so there's not much that can be done to make the car personalized to you, if that is even desired.
  3. The excitement around the release of the Air and now the Gravity, at the end of your lease do you carry that emotion on to the next car you're interesting in leasing?
  4. What would change you from being a leasing type person to the owning type?
  5. Considering the issues discussed on this forum that relate to driving an Air and so-to-be Gravity, how does leasing impact your response when issues are encountered, considered your driving experience is finite based on the lease term? A person financing a car has to consider the financial impact of depreciation; you're spared that dilemma.
I am a value shopper, generally not bound to any specific brand. Where I live (NYC) the dealer experience is universally horrible so I have not formed any ties.

I have a list of things I need the vehicle to do and I go and purchase the fanciest vehicle at the cheapest price to get to my objective.

I have leased once, purchased many, generally paying off instantly and at most in 3 years if given 0% interest.

Vehicles generally stick with me around 2 years even though my current vehicle, Lincoln Aviator Black Label is with me almost 5, it has been very difficult to replace it as it checks all the boxes and with tuning continues to get faster while staying reliable. It has pickup and delivery for any service calls to any dealer within 50 miles, I generally send it out around 30 to either upstate NY or NJ.

Being that I have extended warranty for another 3 years I am in the camp of a non-rushed Lucid customer who can be converted with a deal or lost through high finance rates and EV incentives absorbed by the company instead of being passed down.

I could pay cash, but the idea of someone else making 4+% on that $$ does not sit well with me.

I don’t must have a Gravity but I would like to. Have been obsessively following, reading, digesting any bits of info I could find for over a year. Had my order in since before 9am est on Nov 7.

My current vehicle is excellent and I have found through research that other gas vehicles are simply not a big enough improvement to move on, Gravity alone checks all the boxes.

If I don’t buy now, chances are I will grab a Dream within 2 years, not because I need the power, just because it will be a steal second hand, probably well under 100k and under 20k miles.

That’s me in a nut shell, hopefully my rant answered some of what you asked.
 
During your leasing experiences, does brand loyalty ever impact your decision? i.e. do you plan to stay with a Lucid with your future leases or are you hopeful to one day "own" a Lucid?
Yes, loyal to the brand but generally lean towards leasing as in the EV space particularly the tech is getting outdated very quickly so swapping cars out on a 3 year basis keeps you updated.

A car is just a physical item, but do you ever develop any type of attachment to the car your leasing or is it just a resource to be used until you move on to the next resource? Customizations are limited, so there's not much that can be done to make the car personalized to you, if that is even desired.
Not enough to make me keep one yet regardless of how much I like it.

What would change you from being a leasing type person to the owning type?
The tech and depreciation needs to stabilize (somewhat). Can I forgo a some new buttons, layouts or bigger, clearer screen etc.? Yes, but if ADAS, Range, Charging Speeds takes a decent leap then I would continue to lease. Like I've said before, whether you have $150K cash to drop on a Gravity if its anything like the Air its going to depreciate very aggressively and that kind of money can be put to good use elsewhere into either an appreciating asset or investment.

For me, purchasing the Air was the stupidest decision I could have made from a financial standpoint. Do I regret owning it? no, but in hindsight I would have felt more comfortable had I leased it and Lucid took the depreciation hit. I didn't expect it to depreciate as aggressively as it has and it's not a Lucid problem entirely it's an EV problem in general, although I do think Lucid's brand awareness is playing a role in the values tanking also. Yes, Lucid is a luxury car so will depreciate quicker than a normal car but it also got hit with an EV depreciation that hasn't stabilized in the market yet. EV tech is rapidly changing, you just need to look at the Air compared to the Gravity so while this game plays out EV's are going to take larger depreciation hits. The frustration with the Gravity delay is that the longer time goes on the Air continues to depreciate. Being generous, at the time of ordering I probably could have traded the Air for $60K to $70K but now it's looking more like $50K to $60K. The longer Lucid drags it feet the Air just keeps tanking.

Some people are fine with throwing cash away, I am to some extent as I purchased a luxury car but even I have my limits of how much cash I'm willing to throw at something to just see it disappear so aggressively. To each their own though.
 
Not commenting on anyone in particular, just on the EV market in general (so hopefully no one is offended).

People lament the large depreciation of EVs. They also don't want to own one more than a couple of years because the tech gets outdated. Aren't these two sides of the same coin?

Also with the large depreciation shouldn't we expect residuals to be low and lease payments high?
 
Not commenting on anyone in particular, just on the EV market in general (so hopefully no one is offended).

People lament the large depreciation of EVs. They also don't want to own one more than a couple of years because the tech gets outdated. Aren't these two sides of the same coin?

Also with the large depreciation shouldn't we expect residuals to be low and lease payments high?
I 100% get the desire to frequently move to a new vehicle as the technology improves. And obviously improving technology contributes to rapid depreciation. So yeah, two sides of the same coin.

I tend to own cars long term, and keep them until they're fairly high mileage. I've never sold a car off before I've put 100,000 miles on the odometer. My current vehicle was purchased in 2018, and I've averaged about 17,000 miles a year. My purchase decision is based on whether I think a vehicle is good enough to be happy with for 7+ years of ownership. Modern "software defined vehicles" actually make that decision a bit easier, as there's a reasonable chance that the vehicle will steadily get better features. The number one thing that would cause me to dump a low mileage vehicle is if fundamentally better safety technology became available in new vehicles. My mother was killed in an auto accident, and I'd like to go out in a different fashion.
 
I'm the same, I tend to get rid of cars when they rust out from under me. The last 4 I sold had 150k, 200k, 280k and 250k miles and we're between 16 an 19 years old when sold.
 
I am a value shopper, generally not bound to any specific brand. Where I live (NYC) the dealer experience is universally horrible so I have not formed any ties.

I have a list of things I need the vehicle to do and I go and purchase the fanciest vehicle at the cheapest price to get to my objective.

I have leased once, purchased many, generally paying off instantly and at most in 3 years if given 0% interest.

Vehicles generally stick with me around 2 years even though my current vehicle, Lincoln Aviator Black Label is with me almost 5, it has been very difficult to replace it as it checks all the boxes and with tuning continues to get faster while staying reliable. It has pickup and delivery for any service calls to any dealer within 50 miles, I generally send it out around 30 to either upstate NY or NJ.

Being that I have extended warranty for another 3 years I am in the camp of a non-rushed Lucid customer who can be converted with a deal or lost through high finance rates and EV incentives absorbed by the company instead of being passed down.

I could pay cash, but the idea of someone else making 4+% on that $$ does not sit well with me.

I don’t must have a Gravity but I would like to. Have been obsessively following, reading, digesting any bits of info I could find for over a year. Had my order in since before 9am est on Nov 7.

My current vehicle is excellent and I have found through research that other gas vehicles are simply not a big enough improvement to move on, Gravity alone checks all the boxes.

If I don’t buy now, chances are I will grab a Dream within 2 years, not because I need the power, just because it will be a steal second hand, probably well under 100k and under 20k miles.

That’s me in a nut shell, hopefully my rant answered some of what you asked.
First, thank you for responding.

Your first sentence was a good precursor for all that followed.
Your current vehicle appears to be an anomaly to your usual 2 year ownership, and yet it's consistent with your identity as a value shopper; value remains in Aviator, with the help of an extended warranty and service pickup/delivery.

Based on the three years left on the extended warranty and the possible deals on a GDE in 2 years, sounds like you'll be owning one in 2 years.
Once I take delivery on my GGT, I guess I'm offiicially signing up as one of your guinea pigs for the next 2 years.
Stay tuned. :)
 
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First, thank you for responding.

Your first sentence was a good precursor for all that followed.
Your current vehicle appears to be an anomaly to your usual 2 year ownership, and yet it's consistent with your identity as a value shopper; value remains in Aviator, with the help of an extended warranty and service pickup/delivery.

Based on the three years left on the extended warranty and the possible deals on a GDE in 2 years, sounds like you'll be owning one in 2 years.
Once I take delivery on my GGT, I guess I'm offiicially signing up as one of your guinea pigs for the next 2 years.
Stay tuned. :)
You underestimate the level of chaos…pretty sure I will have Gravity within the year and my Aviator will appreciate in price at the same time. Go big or go home eh!
 
I posted this message in the Lucid Gravity Lease vs. Finance thread, but I'm posting here in order to get additional responses.

And I'm posting this additional paragraph to make clear the intent and tone of my post.
I know the tone of text-based messages can't always be communicated, but I want to do so.
I, in no way, am intending to minimize the lease experience or criticize those who choose to lease.
We're all adults and make decisions that work for our lives.
Hopefully, my post is of interest to others who've had the same questions.

I think I've had a coming to Jesus (aka "be honest with yourself") moment.
I've watched this thread and other leasing-related threads as part of learning the intricacies of car leasing.
I've known the basics of car leasing for some time, but never had the need or desire to delve in deeper for better understanding in order to seriously consider it until my decision a couple of years ago to get a new car in 2025. Learning about EVs has been enlightening enough and gaining knowledge of the leasing experience has been fascinating.

@PetevB and anyone else who has responded to any of my posts about leasing, I appreciate your input. I welcome input that challenges my thinking. I consider myself a lifelong learner.

I'm just an "owning" type person.
I like having my own stuff and the experience of taking care of it.
The cars I've owned over the years had memories attached to them; sentimental value.
I keep them until I determine it is no longer economically feasible to do so. A key decision for me moving forward considering the eventual need for battery replacement or whatever is possible in the future.
Financially, Leashackr and every analysis I've done, indicates ownership is best for me.
As the Seinfeld cast would say "yada yada yada". I'll spare you the details of my story.
Now to my questions, for those willing to respond.

For those of you who know you're just a "leasing" type person, for whatever reason; most common I've heard is the desire to drive something new every 3 years or so:

  1. During your leasing experiences, does brand loyalty ever impact your decision? i.e. do you plan to stay with a Lucid with your future leases or are you hopeful to one day "own" a Lucid?
  2. A car is just a physical item, but do you ever develop any type of attachment to the car your leasing or is it just a resource to be used until you move on to the next resource? Customizations are limited, so there's not much that can be done to make the car personalized to you, if that is even desired.
  3. The excitement around the release of the Air and now the Gravity, at the end of your lease do you carry that emotion on to the next car you're interesting in leasing?
  4. What would change you from being a leasing type person to the owning type?
  5. Considering the issues discussed on this forum that relate to driving an Air and so-to-be Gravity, how does leasing impact your response when issues are encountered, considered your driving experience is finite based on the lease term? A person financing a car has to consider the financial impact of depreciation; you're spared that dilemma.
I heavily lean towards owning, even tho I change cars every 18 months or so. I am fine - actually I enjoy - buying and selling the cars myself, so I get the most out of the transaction. But for now owning an EV is completely and utterly out of the question, given how fast the technology advances and how much they depreciate. When the technology will hit a relative plateau, like with ICE, I might consider buying/owning.
 
Yes, loyal to the brand but generally lean towards leasing as in the EV space particularly the tech is getting outdated very quickly so swapping cars out on a 3 year basis keeps you updated.


Not enough to make me keep one yet regardless of how much I like it.


The tech and depreciation needs to stabilize (somewhat). Can I forgo a some new buttons, layouts or bigger, clearer screen etc.? Yes, but if ADAS, Range, Charging Speeds takes a decent leap then I would continue to lease. Like I've said before, whether you have $150K cash to drop on a Gravity if its anything like the Air its going to depreciate very aggressively and that kind of money can be put to good use elsewhere into either an appreciating asset or investment.

For me, purchasing the Air was the stupidest decision I could have made from a financial standpoint. Do I regret owning it? no, but in hindsight I would have felt more comfortable had I leased it and Lucid took the depreciation hit. I didn't expect it to depreciate as aggressively as it has and it's not a Lucid problem entirely it's an EV problem in general, although I do think Lucid's brand awareness is playing a role in the values tanking also. Yes, Lucid is a luxury car so will depreciate quicker than a normal car but it also got hit with an EV depreciation that hasn't stabilized in the market yet. EV tech is rapidly changing, you just need to look at the Air compared to the Gravity so while this game plays out EV's are going to take larger depreciation hits. The frustration with the Gravity delay is that the longer time goes on the Air continues to depreciate. Being generous, at the time of ordering I probably could have traded the Air for $60K to $70K but now it's looking more like $50K to $60K. The longer Lucid drags it feet the Air just keeps tanking.

Some people are fine with throwing cash away, I am to some extent as I purchased a luxury car but even I have my limits of how much cash I'm willing to throw at something to just see it disappear so aggressively. To each their own though.
Thanks for responding.
You're responses help me better understand your responses on the forum about the delay in the Gravity production/delivery.

When I read "For me, purchasing the Air ..." I was like, what!? He purchased?
However, the words "the stupidest decision I could have made" made sense.
Lucid needs to get on the stick and stop losing your money!
 
Not commenting on anyone in particular, just on the EV market in general (so hopefully no one is offended).

People lament the large depreciation of EVs. They also don't want to own one more than a couple of years because the tech gets outdated. Aren't these two sides of the same coin?

Also with the large depreciation shouldn't we expect residuals to be low and lease payments high?
Can't have the cake and eat it too I suppose.
 
I 100% get the desire to frequently move to a new vehicle as the technology improves. And obviously improving technology contributes to rapid depreciation. So yeah, two sides of the same coin.

I tend to own cars long term, and keep them until they're fairly high mileage. I've never sold a car off before I've put 100,000 miles on the odometer. My current vehicle was purchased in 2018, and I've averaged about 17,000 miles a year. My purchase decision is based on whether I think a vehicle is good enough to be happy with for 7+ years of ownership. Modern "software defined vehicles" actually make that decision a bit easier, as there's a reasonable chance that the vehicle will steadily get better features. The number one thing that would cause me to dump a low mileage vehicle is if fundamentally better safety technology became available in new vehicles. My mother was killed in an auto accident, and I'd like to go out in a different fashion.
Sounds like you're over your 100k mileage average, so Gravity comes along just at the right time to "purchase". Yes?
 
I'm the same, I tend to get rid of cars when they rust out from under me. The last 4 I sold had 150k, 200k, 280k and 250k miles and we're between 16 an 19 years old when sold.
It's gonna be awhile before rust is an issue with your Gravity.
You'll be the one on the forum in 15 years telling us how you're still on the original battery for your Gravity.

Might you consider replacing it, especially if the cost decreases? Ten to fifteen years is a lot time for costs to go down and tech to improve.
That replacment battery should have better range than the original.
 
But for now owning an EV is completely and utterly out of the question
After reading your first sentence, I was like "what the ...".
So glad you clarified.

It will be interesting to see what the "relative plateau" is.
By that time, I'll just ride along with my children or grands.
 
Sounds like you're over your 100k mileage average, so Gravity comes along just at the right time to "purchase". Yes?
Yes. So far, I've only owned ICE vehicles. In 2018, EVs didn't seem quite ready for how I drive, which include frequent long road trips, and also I drive between Lake Tahoe and San Francisco on an almost weekly basis, and I want to be able to make the up-hill SF to Tahoe trip in cold weather without stopping. My Toyota Highlander is still working fine, but it is starting show signs of age. And while it has reasonable safety systems, it's definitely not state-of-the art. The final part of the equation is I'm a bleeding-heart liberal tree-hugger, and I'm willing to spend some money for the environmental bragging rights. :p
 
Not commenting on anyone in particular, just on the EV market in general (so hopefully no one is offended).

People lament the large depreciation of EVs. They also don't want to own one more than a couple of years because the tech gets outdated. Aren't these two sides of the same coin?

Also with the large depreciation shouldn't we expect residuals to be low and lease payments high?
I see five main factors negatively impacting current Lucid or EV valuations, two to three of which I think will change medium term.

1. Battery longevity and cost. Generally the other mechanicals of EVs are both simpler and last longer that ICE cars, but the battery is the weak link. Replacement costs of the main battery on a Mercedes EQS, for example, is just under 50k. If that holds the car effectively becomes disposable when the battery dies, meaning no one wants to be left holding the bag towards the end of the battery's life, which is currently feared to be short. As battery longevity improves and replacement costs go down, however, resale value will improve, as EVs are very cheap to run (fuel, maintain) otherwise. The Nissan Leaf is a good example: you can get a ten year old Leaf with a near dead battery for under 3k, but now that 5k aftermarket replacement batteries are becoming available that will bump the car from 72 miles range when new to >250 those used cars are actually starting to get more valuable. Running costs are extremely cheap...

2. Government incentives. The tax credit effectively discounts new EVs massively, especially if they are leased, so there's big pressure on used prices because new prices are so cheap. Meanwhile the used market is getting flooded with cars coming off lease, putting further pressure on new residuals. Remove the incentives, however, and you may well get a rebound effect: new prices go up making used look attractive, so if you assume the tax incentive will go away (as I do) that likely reduces depreciation temporarily.

3. Overcapacity in the marketspace. In their race to lead the emerging EV market space most companies have been deficit spending (intentionally or otherwise) putting more capacity online than the market needs. It's unclear how much this is due to temporary miscalculation vs a strategic strategy for market dominance, but it's certainly some of each and hence the oversupply is likely to self-correct somewhat in the medium term. The biggest factor here is probably what Lucid actually does: if they don't tool up for large volume the Gravity will stay in short supply, propping up both new and used prices. If, on the other hand, they spin up both the US and Saudi Arabia factories I think values will tank, much like the Model Y when all that capacity hit.

4. Already alluded to: cars have a smaller and smaller mechanical hardware component along with a larger electronic hardware and software component. The first part does date, but it's not too fast. My 2018 Model 3 Dual Motor was a little shorter range, a little rougher, etc than a new Model 3 or similar but it wasn't huge. However that second part, the electronic hardware, depreciates like a new smartphone. Today's self-driving tech is yesterday's center dash nav system: it'll be cringe-worthy in a decade.

5. Lucid's got some amount of lack of confidence working against them- it's unclear how buggy/ expensive/ difficult a used Lucid will be to support and repair going forwards, so that puts downward pressure on value.

Taking this back to the Gravity specifically:

1) The batteries should (I hope) cycle out very slowly if taken care of- they're big so they see fewer cycles, while the range both lets you keep them at a lower SOC, reducing degradation, as well as tolerate more degradation because even shorter range will still be more than enough. When batteries do eventually need to be replaced aftermarket options might be more commonplace.
2) The incentives are likely to work in the Gravity's favor, if anything, in the medium term.
3) Factory over-capacity is a real concern based on announced plans.
4) Tech will date in all new cars. Do you care or not?
5) Buggy/ difficult to maintain might be addressed over the next few years. Or it might not...

I don't care about 4 (newest electronic hardware tech)- I don't need the latest self driving tech. So it it wasn't for factory over-capacity and questions about Lucid's health and competence I'd actually be pretty bullish about buying and holding for 7+ years. I'd likely still have my Model 3 if the battery hadn't become a concern at ~80k miles, and I'm betting that won't be an issue here. But given I do have those questions I'd prefer to hedge with a lease and then buy it out if things look good. But I'm not going to pay over sticker to do it, which is effectively what Lucid is asking with their current lease terms.
 
I'd likely still have my Model 3 if the battery hadn't become a concern at ~80k miles, and I'm betting that won't be an issue here.
What happened to your battery? The Gravity also uses Panasonic 2170 cells like the Model 3 (10% more energy density and maybe optimized for top plate cooling?). I don't see any reason to believe they'll be more reliable though as far as I've seen the original Model 3 packs are very reliable.
 
What happened to your battery? The Gravity also uses Panasonic 2170 cells like the Model 3 (10% more energy density and maybe optimized for top plate cooling?). I don't see any reason to believe they'll be more reliable though as far as I've seen the original Model 3 packs are very reliable.
Musk turned it off ...
 
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