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To Sapphire or to not?

M

mac26mac

Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2021
Messages
51
Cars
Audi Etron
DE Number
087
The mrs. gave me the okay to order (as long as I get rid of the DE-P and get at least what we paid for it back, less depreciation). But I'm not sure I even want it. What are everyone's thoughts on the following:


1. Range: I'm fine with my current range out of my DE-P. But it's at the bottom tier of where I'd want range to be (for me). Any thoughts on what range will be?
2. Would you use your Sapphire as a daily driver? (SHOULD you?). If not, I'd have to add about $40k to the price for a DD (not to mention the additional insurance).
3. Is 100 hp worth the additional $70k? What am I missing? (I know it's an entirely different motor set up...but yeah).
4. Will the market be "flooded" with people ditching their DE/GT+ for the Sapphire (meaning the market will be soft on prices)?
5. Will Lucid introduce a Sapphire+ or some other car that I will want?! (the answer to this is yes).
 
1 If range is a priority, that is a strike against the change
2 Only matters how you will use the car and yes if you DD it, your cost structure moves up
3 The Sapphire is more likely to have 1600 HP, that 1200+ is a snow job
4 I kind of think a lot of the Sapphire customers will be coming from xyz brands and not create a flood of used other Airs. The Sapphire is a car for winning pissing contests and that means McLaren customers
5 Companies do not stand still, there will be even cooler stuff, we all know that
 
I’d wait a few years just to see how Lucid settles into the market. You already have a limited edition car and at the current specs of the Sapphire compared to the Dream P, I don’t think the price justifies it. Although, I don’t think 1200hp is going to be the final number.

Lucid’s don’t seem to be in high demand on the secondhand market either. People turning them over aren’t making money on them or even breaking even. I feel they need to get the brand recognized more before we’ll see demand in the secondhand market.

It’s definitely a nice looking car but at $250K excluding taxes, it’s a very costly beast for little reward compared to the Dream P. Unless money isn’t a concern and it’s more about bragging rights then go for it :p
 
I don‘t think the range hit is going to be very big.
The wheels have aero covers and the 2 motors in the back are going to be just as efficient as the one motor.
The performance difference is more than just another motor. The brakes are much improved, the suspension is improved, and tuning is improved by dynamically using the rear motors to help rotate the car.
I plan to daily drive the Sapphire and also do some HPDE.
It’s worth it to me, but I don’t expect it to be a great value.
I expect a 10-15% depreciation hit on a one year old DE-P with over 10k miles.
I would expect similar depreciation for a daily driven Sapphire.
There will always be something new. Pace of change with EVs will be fast and furious.
Looking at numbers for the Nevera, we are at a point of very diminishing returns.
I can see keeping the Sapphire for awhile.
 
  • Nevera
    Acceleration* (0-60mph)
    1.85 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • Acceleration* 0-100 km/h / (0-62mph)
    1.97 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • Acceleration* 0-300 km/h
    9.3 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • ¼ mile time (0-402 m)
    8.582 sec
 
Bill55 said:
  • Nevera
    Acceleration* (0-60mph)
    1.85 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • Acceleration* 0-100 km/h / (0-62mph)
    1.97 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • Acceleration* 0-300 km/h
    9.3 sec
    *high-friction surface, one foot roll-out
  • ¼ mile time (0-402 m)
    8.582 sec
Click to expand...
2.1 million vs. .0250 million.
 
I’m shallow and superficial, so yes. I’d Sapphire.
 
Dealership service is meaningful
Rimac has 10 partners in the US, the closest to Chicago is in Toronto
 
It would be tough to get other rims due to the center lock. You better hope you don’t have a lot of potholes in your neighborhood
 
Only once in my life have I not opted to move up when a more powerful model of a car I owned and liked hit the market. When Tesla introduced the "Ludicrous" power upgrade over the P90D I already had, I just did not see the point. For the first time ever in my car-owning life, the car already had more power than I could use in the places I drove, and nothing else about the car was changed with the power upgrade.

The Sapphire presents a more complex question. It's similar to other Airs in many key features, but it also differs in ways that will make a fundamental (although incremental) difference to the driving experience, particularly related to rear torque vectoring and a change in power-to-weight ratio that will kick the Air into that rarified class of cars that seem to repeal the laws of inertia (as our Model S Plaid does). On the other hand, I'd be giving up a Dream Edition with a subtle exterior styling and an interior color palette that I like better than any car I have owned (and better than the Sapphire) -- and that already has stupendous dynamic performance.

The other complication is that I'm turning 71 this month, and I have a different perspective on waiting for even more enticing performance cars that I may no longer be able to drive safely in ways that make use of their capabilities. So the Sapphire might be my last chance.

Oh, what to do, what to do . . . ?

I've floated the idea of replacing the Plaid with the Sapphire and keeping the Air Dream as our second sedan, but it hasn't exactly caught traction on the home front, in part because neither of us is yet confident that Lucid will have its software woes worked out by the time the Sapphire hits the market.
 
Last edited:
hmp10 said:
Only once in my life have I not opted to move up when a more powerful model of a car I owned and liked hit the market. When Tesla introduced the "Ludicrous" power upgrade over the P90D I already had, I just did not see the point. For the first time ever in my car-owning life, the car already had more power than I could use in the places I drove, and nothing else about the car was changed with the power upgrade.

The Sapphire presents a more complex question. It's similar to other Airs in many key features, but it also differs in ways that will make a fundamental (although incremental) difference to the driving experience, particularly related to rear torque vectoring and a change in power-to-weight ratio that will kick the Air into that rarified class of cars that seem to repeal the laws of inertia (as our Model S Plaid does). On the other hand, I'd be giving up a Dream Edition with a subtle exterior styling and an interior color palette that I like better than any car I have owned (and better than the Sapphire) -- and that already has stupendous dynamic performance.

The other complication is that I'm turning 71 this month, and I have a different perspective on waiting for even more enticing performance cars that I may no longer be able to drive safely in ways that make use of their capabilities. So the Sapphire might be my last chance.

Oh, what to do, what to do . . . ?

I've floated the idea of replacing the Plaid with the Sapphire and keeping the Air Dream as our second sedan, but it hasn't exactly caught traction on the home front.
Click to expand...
Always take that last shot!
 
For me personally, I want a car I can have fun driving, not just the car with the most impressive lap times/spec sheet.

The sapphire will probably have capabilities that can't be fully utilized on the street, so I figure it'll come down to how much fun you can have doing HPDE/track days. It doesn't seem like any of the changes should compromise it too much for street use, so it still should be reasonable as a street car/daily driver, at least by the standards of performance focused street cars.

Right now EVs all seem to struggle with stamina on track, if the Sapphire is different I'd definitely be interested. Tires/charging/drivetrain overheating issues all seem to limit EVs at the track currently, and there's no reason to think the Sapphire would escape all of those issues. That's not a knock against Lucid, just the reality of where charging infrastructure and EV tech is today.

The car will still be amazing from the standpoint of looking cool and demonstrating what's possible, but at least for me I don't know the actual experience of owning/driving one necessarily justifies the huge step up in price.
 
I would use as a daily drivers for sure but for me , I would wait until the software irons itself out. I love the car and the drive but swear at it as well. In my head, I might be able to justify the issues at 140k but can’t at 250k. The question you have to ask yourself is how often will you be using the extra horsepower? Do you plan on getting in races with cameros/chargers/tesla/… every day? Do you live on a drag strip? If yes, then buy it…. If not then think about it 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
If I were in your position with a DE-P that has positive equity, I would go for it if it didn’t cause a divorce. Easy for a forum member like me to tell you to spend more money, but it’s a phenomenal car that I think you will do fine with over time. I’m not saying it will appreciate like a Roadster, but it is a car that dethroned the Plaid.
 
abbas2099 said:
I would use as a daily drivers for sure but for me , I would wait until the software irons itself out. I love the car and the drive but swear at it as well. In my head, I might be able to justify the issues at 140k but can’t at 250k. The question you have to ask yourself is how often will you be using the extra horsepower? Do you plan on getting in races with cameros/chargers/tesla/… every day? Do you live on a drag strip? If yes, then buy it…. If not then think about it 🤷🏻‍♂️
Click to expand...

The software is the main reason I'm on the "pause" button, too (with the boy racer looks and the loss of that beautiful Santa Monica interior in our Dream playing a lesser role). With the software problems I'm still seeing over eight months after taking delivery of our Dream P, I'm not sure another 6-12 months will mean a Sapphire without similar problems.

In terms of where I would use the extra power, it's not about more top-end speed or even acceleration off the line, as our Dream P already produces more oomph off the line than the tires can handle without traction control kicking in. It's more about that sense our Model S Plaid conveys of not being subject to the laws of inertia during dynamic maneuvers from speed that will come from the step up in power-to-weight ratio. But the Plaid delivers its punch without the handling, room, comfort, and chassis finesse the Sapphire will deliver. The Plaid is insanely quick. But without rear torque vectoring, with the excessive rear weight bias of its heavy dual-motor setup, with the hysteresis lag of an air suspension, and with the lower torsional stiffness of the body, the Plaid brings a lot more baggage to the party than the Lucid.
 
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